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linux FFS kernel support
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Join Date: Apr 2007
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Junior Poster in Training
why is it every time i load a new distro i never find one that has default FFS support? why is it however that virtually/probably every distro out there comes ready to read proprietary FAT(FAT16), VFAT(FAT32) and NTFS partitions but not non-proprietary filesystems such as FFS?!?
*BSD are opensource too and they deserve to be treated with respect! i notice that when i plugged an old HD in, that had openbsd on it and tried to mount an ext3 FS it worked perfectly and i was able to get my data, so they aren't biased in that respect!
i am getting sick of recompiling the kernel just to make this simple change that has virtually no impact, if any at all, on the size/footprint of the kernel!
does anyone know of any distro's that come out the box with ffs support please?
*BSD are opensource too and they deserve to be treated with respect! i notice that when i plugged an old HD in, that had openbsd on it and tried to mount an ext3 FS it worked perfectly and i was able to get my data, so they aren't biased in that respect!
i am getting sick of recompiling the kernel just to make this simple change that has virtually no impact, if any at all, on the size/footprint of the kernel!
does anyone know of any distro's that come out the box with ffs support please?
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Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 5,050
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>why is it every time i load a new distro i never find one that has
>default FFS support?
Probably because FFS isn't very popular.
>why is it however that virtually/probably every distro out there comes
>ready to read proprietary FAT(FAT16), VFAT(FAT32) and NTFS partitions
Probably because FAT, VFAT, and NTFS are popular.
>*BSD are opensource too and they deserve to be treated with respect!
I'm sure that if Linux distro developers went out and found every obscure (but open source) filesystem, they would end up with a lot of unnecessary kernel bloat.
As for distros that come with FFS support "out of the box", sorry, I am not aware of any.
>default FFS support?
Probably because FFS isn't very popular.
>why is it however that virtually/probably every distro out there comes
>ready to read proprietary FAT(FAT16), VFAT(FAT32) and NTFS partitions
Probably because FAT, VFAT, and NTFS are popular.
>*BSD are opensource too and they deserve to be treated with respect!
I'm sure that if Linux distro developers went out and found every obscure (but open source) filesystem, they would end up with a lot of unnecessary kernel bloat.
As for distros that come with FFS support "out of the box", sorry, I am not aware of any.
"Technological progress is like an axe in the hands of a pathological criminal."
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Join Date: Apr 2007
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Junior Poster in Training
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Originally Posted by joeprogrammer 
>why is it every time i load a new distro i never find one that has
>default FFS support?
Probably because FFS isn't very popular.
YOU HAVE O BE JOKING, how naive can you get, don't start trolling mate, your big head doesn't become you, if you can't talk sense, don't post at all
>why is it however that virtually/probably every distro out there comes
>ready to read proprietary FAT(FAT16), VFAT(FAT32) and NTFS partitions
Probably because FAT, VFAT, and NTFS are popular.
duuuuh! i was referering to the fact that the opensource communities should stick together as well as being compliant to proprietary systems, i think anyone can see that
>*BSD are opensource too and they deserve to be treated with respect!
I'm sure that if Linux distro developers went out and found every obscure (but open source) filesystem, they would end up with a lot of unnecessary kernel bloat.
OBSCURE!? you DO INDEED talk out of your hat mate, and a certain other orrifice too!
As for distros that come with FFS support "out of the box", sorry, I am not aware of any.
stop trolling in the threads i created to make them look bad and stop following me round like a lost sheep
if you want to give answers to my problems thats fine, but this is plain harrassment, no wonder people are leaving, you are a detrement to daniweb!
I dont know, many distros are dropping support for reiserfs (after the murder) and other more obscure filesystems like XFS and JFS in favout of the more mainsteream ext3
If i am helpful, please give me reputation points.
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Join Date: Mar 2006
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Originally Posted by alienlinux
see you never needed to post here at all!
stop trolling in the threads i created to make them look bad and stop following me round like a lost sheep
if you want to give answers to my problems thats fine, but this is plain harrassment, no wonder people are leaving, you are a detrement to daniweb!
He is perfectly entitled to contribute to the same threads as you, and the fact that he is doing so within forums that he has always been active in would suggest he is not following you around.
Threads are open to be debated, for differing opinions to be aired, that does not constitute harassment.
Keep it real!
Davey Winder
Information Security Journalist of the Year
www.happygeek.com
Follow me on Twitter: @happygeek
Information Security Journalist of the Year
www.happygeek.com
Follow me on Twitter: @happygeek
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Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 91
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Junior Poster in Training
yep, i agree like 99% mate, and this is the real me and my real opinions. threads are to solve issues and to expand knowledge, not to distribute what is obviously a bias toward the person and not toward the thread subject itself!
calm is what calm receives, and they don't get any calmer and still stay sensible. did i say anything about jbennets post? no, thats coz jbennet as i have read his posts time and time again speaks nothing but sense. please start moderating on a larger scale and then you won't have to deal with this sort of thing, if i were you (and i know i'm not before you get uppity), i would reduce threads like this one to its very first post
calm is what calm receives, and they don't get any calmer and still stay sensible. did i say anything about jbennets post? no, thats coz jbennet as i have read his posts time and time again speaks nothing but sense. please start moderating on a larger scale and then you won't have to deal with this sort of thing, if i were you (and i know i'm not before you get uppity), i would reduce threads like this one to its very first post
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Join Date: Apr 2006
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Originally Posted by alienlinux
see you never needed to post here at all!
stop trolling in the threads i created to make them look bad and stop following me round like a lost sheep
if you want to give answers to my problems thats fine, but this is plain harrassment, no wonder people are leaving, you are a detrement to daniweb!
For the record, I reply to just about anything that I have something to say. I did not have any malicious attempt whatsoever when I wrote that post, and stating that people are leaving because of me is just plain ignorance. mepnoob is the first person in all my forum history who has left because of a thread that I happened to be posting in. Oh, and he freaked out at Davey and TheNNS, not me.
"Technological progress is like an axe in the hands of a pathological criminal."
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Join Date: Apr 2007
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Junior Poster in Training
well ok joe, thats fair comment, lets have some statistics and facts.
OpenBSD is reputadly the most secure operating system in the world boasting only 2 remote holes in its default install in over 10 years. FACT
It is opensource and therefore deserves the respect of the opensource community. I'd say so!
Adding the FFS support to the Linux kernel makes no measurable impact on performance and virtually if any impact on the size/footprint of the kernel.
if that last statement is fact, then whats the harm in supporting it? after all, they support Linux ext2. does M$ support Linux etc? i think not, you have to BUY captain nemo if you want to write to a non dos partition.
why do you have to belittle everything people say? I'm not trying to be mean joe, i'm trying to make a decent contribution in order to become well liked, shouldn't everyone do that? then we get statements like "Probably because FFS isn't very popular." - now a newb will look at that and assume openbsd is no good and never bother with it. I've noticed that most all of your posts are sensible and true, but be carefull. when allways being true to yourself and others, it makes it easy for people to see when your posting based on a personal bias which is what this nonsense seems to do.
there's no harm to having FFS and you know it!
thats it, there's nothing more to add, what can be the harm? i mean come on man. and just for the noobs. OPENBSD IS ALL THAT!!!
having an OpenBSD gateway and a Linux desktop are a match made in heaven. i've used dos since 5.0, and linux and openbsd for 10 years now. finally dropped windows completely last christmas because i REALLY don't need it anymore. i have all mine running in wine or ports.
and as for me proving that it hasn't the popularity when compared to others
1) YOU made the claim, YOU back it up mate, I ain't your gopher!
2) Don't base everything on popularity, if it has 10,000 users versus 10,000,000 users on something else, it doesn't make it a valid reason for non-support when the support is there and so simple to integrate and causes no harm!
3) you (and i am counting) have made wild undocumented naiive statements like this 3 times as i remember so far and i see you have a predilection for it
sorry mate but i just say it as i see it
no heat no mallice, just plain common sence
OpenBSD is reputadly the most secure operating system in the world boasting only 2 remote holes in its default install in over 10 years. FACT
It is opensource and therefore deserves the respect of the opensource community. I'd say so!
Adding the FFS support to the Linux kernel makes no measurable impact on performance and virtually if any impact on the size/footprint of the kernel.
if that last statement is fact, then whats the harm in supporting it? after all, they support Linux ext2. does M$ support Linux etc? i think not, you have to BUY captain nemo if you want to write to a non dos partition.
why do you have to belittle everything people say? I'm not trying to be mean joe, i'm trying to make a decent contribution in order to become well liked, shouldn't everyone do that? then we get statements like "Probably because FFS isn't very popular." - now a newb will look at that and assume openbsd is no good and never bother with it. I've noticed that most all of your posts are sensible and true, but be carefull. when allways being true to yourself and others, it makes it easy for people to see when your posting based on a personal bias which is what this nonsense seems to do.
there's no harm to having FFS and you know it!
thats it, there's nothing more to add, what can be the harm? i mean come on man. and just for the noobs. OPENBSD IS ALL THAT!!!
having an OpenBSD gateway and a Linux desktop are a match made in heaven. i've used dos since 5.0, and linux and openbsd for 10 years now. finally dropped windows completely last christmas because i REALLY don't need it anymore. i have all mine running in wine or ports.
and as for me proving that it hasn't the popularity when compared to others
1) YOU made the claim, YOU back it up mate, I ain't your gopher!
2) Don't base everything on popularity, if it has 10,000 users versus 10,000,000 users on something else, it doesn't make it a valid reason for non-support when the support is there and so simple to integrate and causes no harm!
3) you (and i am counting) have made wild undocumented naiive statements like this 3 times as i remember so far and i see you have a predilection for it
sorry mate but i just say it as i see it
no heat no mallice, just plain common sence
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Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 5,050
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>whats the harm in supporting it?
I'm no distro expert here, but my guess is that they all add up. There's loads of filesystems that distro developers *could* support, but choose not to.
>why do you have to belittle everything people say?
I don't. Simply put, when picking apart people's posts is more convenient for me to do it, then that is what I will use to reply to them.
>i'm trying to make a decent contribution in order to become well liked
I haven't seen very many people that become well-liked when they claim their opponent is a troll. Regardless, my goal is not to make you look bad, but to challenge your arguments. If my counter arguments are incorrect, feel free to correct me. Otherwise, don't complain.
>we get statements like "Probably because FFS isn't very popular." - now
>a newb will look at that and assume openbsd is no good
You aren't making any sense. Is popularity the determining factor for whether something is "good" or not?
>YOU made the claim, YOU back it up mate, I ain't your gopher!
I never said that you had to provide proof, I simply said at the bare minimum, you should at least let me know if a statement is incorrect, and without flaming.
I am well aware that the burden of truth lies on me for this one. Very well, I have attempted to find some statistics as to the popularity of the FFS filesystem. Since I couldn't find enough statistics via Google, I decided to use Google itself as a statistic and create a chart based on the number of search results from each filesystem. This is not a completely accurate chart; I am aware of that. But I think it can still give a pretty good picture of FFS compared to other filesystems. To remove any ambiguities between the filesystem and other meanings of the acronym, I decided to append "filesystem" to each search term.
As you can see from the char below, the only filesystem which has a lower number of results than FFS is ext4. Given the fact that ext4 has only been a kernel option since 2.6.19, I'd have to say that FFS's popularity is fairly low.
>Don't base everything on popularity, if it has 10,000 users versus
>10,000,000 users on something else, it doesn't make it a valid reason
>for non-support
Yes it does; while we're talking about the subject of fairness, would it be fair to offer default FFS support, while leaving out ReiserFS, JFS, XFS, and a whole lot of others?
See, I think you're misunderstanding the purpose of my posts. My purpose isn't to make OpenBSD look bad. I have heard many positive things about it, and I'm probably going to try it at some point. The whole purpose of my first post in this thread was to suggest a reason as to why FFS isn't supported on most modern distributions.
I'm no distro expert here, but my guess is that they all add up. There's loads of filesystems that distro developers *could* support, but choose not to.
>why do you have to belittle everything people say?
I don't. Simply put, when picking apart people's posts is more convenient for me to do it, then that is what I will use to reply to them.
>i'm trying to make a decent contribution in order to become well liked
I haven't seen very many people that become well-liked when they claim their opponent is a troll. Regardless, my goal is not to make you look bad, but to challenge your arguments. If my counter arguments are incorrect, feel free to correct me. Otherwise, don't complain.
>we get statements like "Probably because FFS isn't very popular." - now
>a newb will look at that and assume openbsd is no good
You aren't making any sense. Is popularity the determining factor for whether something is "good" or not?
>YOU made the claim, YOU back it up mate, I ain't your gopher!
I never said that you had to provide proof, I simply said at the bare minimum, you should at least let me know if a statement is incorrect, and without flaming.
I am well aware that the burden of truth lies on me for this one. Very well, I have attempted to find some statistics as to the popularity of the FFS filesystem. Since I couldn't find enough statistics via Google, I decided to use Google itself as a statistic and create a chart based on the number of search results from each filesystem. This is not a completely accurate chart; I am aware of that. But I think it can still give a pretty good picture of FFS compared to other filesystems. To remove any ambiguities between the filesystem and other meanings of the acronym, I decided to append "filesystem" to each search term.
As you can see from the char below, the only filesystem which has a lower number of results than FFS is ext4. Given the fact that ext4 has only been a kernel option since 2.6.19, I'd have to say that FFS's popularity is fairly low.
>Don't base everything on popularity, if it has 10,000 users versus
>10,000,000 users on something else, it doesn't make it a valid reason
>for non-support
Yes it does; while we're talking about the subject of fairness, would it be fair to offer default FFS support, while leaving out ReiserFS, JFS, XFS, and a whole lot of others?
See, I think you're misunderstanding the purpose of my posts. My purpose isn't to make OpenBSD look bad. I have heard many positive things about it, and I'm probably going to try it at some point. The whole purpose of my first post in this thread was to suggest a reason as to why FFS isn't supported on most modern distributions.
"Technological progress is like an axe in the hands of a pathological criminal."
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