AMD Phenom 9850 Quad-Core 2.5GHz Overheating

[bearemet]

Hi:
I just got a brand new computer from HP. The HP line is HP Elite m9350f with the following specs:

1. AMD Phenom 9850 Quad-Core 2.5GHz
2. 6GB RAM
3. Motherboard: Asus M2N78-LA
4. NVIDIA 9800 GT 512MB
5. Windows Vista Ultimate 64bit Edition

The computer is only a week old. Since I got it, the system was getting freezes where the box didn't respond to any user input (mouse, keyboard, etc) and always had to do a manual restart. I first though there was a problem with Vista and the hardware, so I got ALL the latest drivers for every single piece of hardware in the PC AND got all the possible updates for Windows. My BIOS was up to date and there wasn't anything else I could do, but the system kept freezing. Then I did some more research and find out by using SpeedFan that my CPU is running at excessive high temperature.
The CPU was averaging 76-78C (that's HOT!), and by the time I opened applications like Visual Studio 2008 running Re-Sharper 4.0 the temperature was hiking to 80C and then freezing right away.
I decided to call HP to replace it (since I just got it, and it had 90 days parts and labor and 3 years parts). Well apparently the HP warranty starts from the moment they assembled the PC and not the moment you purchased it, so they told me to my 90 days parts and labor had expired and for them to exchange/fix my problem I had to buy a $99.00 warranty extension... anyways, I'm not going to because probably it'll be cheaper just to buy a better CPU fan and installed myself (the warranty doesn't work anyways).
I've been looking around but haven't found a CPU fan for AM2(the socket) AND that supports Phenom X4 and that fits in my motherboard. Just keep in mind that I have a VERY BIG video card and a medium case. I was hoping some of you with similar configurations could give me some advice.
Thanks in advance to all of you,
Mike

[The New Normal]

I can't believe HP said that, that is pretty rude "your 90 warranty has expired after 7 days". It might be technically true, I don't know, but if it is it's very sneaky.

There's a chance they didn't install the stock one properly. I agree that an aftermarket one is a good idea, but you should try re-installing the stock one to see the temperatures. You should be looking at high 40's celcius, roughly. Use Arctic Silver #5. If that works you may not need to buy a new one.

Most aftermarket coolers work for both intel 775 and AM2, but not all come with the AM2 adapter by default, so keep an eye out for that.
It depends on how extreme you want to be. I love my Noctua cooler, so I'm happy to recommend them, but they're massive and might not suit you, especially if your not overclocking

Noctua NHC123P, click the image gallery
NH-U12P, click image gallery
Zalmans are a bit more 'subtle' CNPS9500 AM2
CNPS9700 NT

EDIT: now I look at the Zalmans, they don't specifically say they support your motherboard, so you may have to measure it yourself

[jbennet]

If its faulty out of the factory due to bad workmanship, it doesnt matter whether it is in warranty, they really aught to replace it. Go ring up and complain. The 90 days from manufacture thing sounds like bullshit to me too.

Beware aftermarket coolers. Dell use nonstandard motherboards and coolers. Normal coolers wont fit (holes dont line up) and its possible HP may do the same.

[bearemet]

Thanks for your support and advice. I took out the fan and heatsink and used the Arctic Silver #5 as suggested but the GPU and CPU temperatures keep the same.
I was thinking that is probably the motherboard since both the GPU and CPU are getting hot. Maybe I'm wrong but, buying a better CPU fan and heatsink will only cool down the CPU and not the GPU. I'm I right or wrong?
Thanks a lot to everyone for all your help, it's all very useful. This site is awesome. Thank you,
MT

[jbennet]

Whats the temp on the 9800? its a poweful card. 55-60 is good. 65-75 is about what you expect when gaming. 85+ is very very bad.

[bearemet]

Whats the temp on the 9800? its a poweful card. 55-60 is good. 65-75 is about what you expect when gaming. 85+ is very very bad.

When I first turn on the PC after being off for a while, the initial temperatures are as follows:
GPU: 35C
CPU: 38C
After 20 minutes idle this is what happens:
GPU: 78C
CPU: 74C

Is bad, isn't it?

[jbennet]

70-80 idle is very bad for idle . they should be 55-65 idle and no more than 75 under heavy load (playing a recent game on max)

[bearemet]

70-80 idle is very bad for idle . they should be 55-65 idle and no more than 75 under heavy load (playing a recent game on max)

OK, so... any suggestion??? HP will not honor my warranty, period. Any ideas on what to do in order to put this to work correctly by myself??? If I buy a new heatsink with fan, plus use the Arctic Silver solve all my problems with the heat for both the CPU and GPU??? How do you solve the heat problem in the GPU anyways? Any other ideas? Should I change the MB. What would you do if the temperatures I showed were happening in your box? Please any advise on how should I proceed will be appreciated. I spent a lot of money on this machine and for now it is useless, I need to get it to work ASAP. Thanks again,
MT

[jbennet]

Buy some case fans with regards to the GPU

The AS5 alone will give up to a 5 degrees drop in CPU temps. With a new quality heatsink and the AS5 you coukd be looking at a drop in CPU temps of up to 10 to 15 degrees, which would bring it back so safe levels. In conjunction with a few case fans you could drop the GPU temp and overall temps by maybe another few degrees.

[The New Normal]

Buy some case fans with regards to the GPU ... With a new quality heatsink and the AS5 you coukd be looking at a drop in CPU temps ... which would bring it back so safe levels

I agree. It sounds like your case is full, and hot air is building up in there. If there's no out-take fan on the back you should get one. I don't know if that case has space for an intake at the front, if it does get one of them too.

Most 9800GTs exhaust into the case, but some go out the back like this one . If your card exhausts out the back make sure the second slot is clear from case brackets.

You can get 'slot coolers' that sit beside a graphics card which may help if you've got a spare slot for one, but I've never tried them.
Vantec
Masscool
There's also a 'spot cooler' which will work in any case as long as you've got a 3 pin plug (or adapter to a 4 pin molex) to plug it in. Again, I've never tried them so I can't say whether they'll actually make much difference. Better case airflow inputs and outputs is the best way.
Antec

[jbennet]

Slot coolers and spot coolers are a bit crap but are okay if you really really need them

Get some 80mm fans, it shoild be IN at the front and OUT at the back. There should be more fans pulling air out then drawing in. That way you get a good flow.

[Maverick223]

I would call them back and 81tch like h3ll. Otherwise replace the hs & fans with replacements from a reputable company such as Thermalright (they make great heatsinks) and Arctic Cooling (best quiet fans available). Also as mentioned above adding a case fan in the front would definately help, if you have the available real estate within your case. Hope this helps, Mav.

[jbennet]

+1

[Chaky]

Wasn't warranty supposed to be issued by the shop, instead of manufacturer? AFAIK, faulty product goes back to the shop where it was purchased from. They have to guarantee for the parts and they are the ones that ship it back to the manufacturer.

Anyway, it sounds to me like the heatsink is not tight enough on both CPU and GPU, or they haven't used proper thermal paste when they assembled it.

[dman4u2]

i strongly suggest buying a better cpu heatsink, seeing as i have a gemini cpu heatsink for my phenom x4 9850 and it runs on maximum load at 55C it idles between 32C-40C
i use my computer for gaming and 3d simulations, i have a large case however so i suggest that you measure the distance from the motherboard to the top of your case make sure there is at least 8inches of space and 6inches of width though they make many other cpu heatinks the gemini is only from 30-45 dollars i got mine for 30.
artic silver is a great choice.

also get this program here
http://www.alcpu.com/CoreTemp/
its helpful for checking cpu load and temp
core temp its free
good luck and dont forget dell is not going to do a whole lot for an extra 90 dollars just slap on another cpu or heatsink and charge you shipping.