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Jan 26th, 2005
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Concept to fruition - the chronicle of a new site

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and potentially a new source of income, for a bum. Just as many IT workers, I was let go in 2002, and since then have not been able to secure a full time job. My background is more on the lower bowels of the Inet (infrastructure, comm & security) of 20+ years, but have enough programming experience to be dangerous.

I have been following search engine optimization way before it became even a niche industry. I followed to rise of the spam "industry", the deployment of business on the web, and watched multi billion dollar investment backed web sites disappear, while shoe-string operations rake in 2 to 3 thousand percent profit margins.

I believe I have found a niche that has not been filled and can make a small business on it.

To deploy I have jotted down my thoughts on what I will need to do.

The concept is as follows -
  1. Select the appropriate technology. The forum software, and portal piece. It has to be flexible, and cannot lock the site into itself.
  2. deploy an online community with a unique interest to attract eyeballs
  3. make sure that the unique interest has sufficient user base, (for example
  4. buggy whips are really cool but there are too few people interested)
  5. Do not initially, or ever charge for visitors
  6. Generate sufficient amount of content to start discussions
  7. Get news (RSS, XML, etc.) feeds to trigger new discussions
  8. Make sure advertisements are managed appropriate throughout the site, and are unobtrusive
  9. Usability is a key element
  10. Find the right key phrases, and get site listed on appropriate systems
  11. Once eyeball momentum is sufficient, enlist members to be moderators
  12. Reward moderators
  13. Reward frequent posters

Right now I am at 1.
Here are so far my selections:

Discussion software: phpBB. I have tried various other ones and phpBB seems to be the most user friendly from the visitors' perspective, and most flexible.

Portal/Content Managment: I truly am not sure if there is much difference between a small portal software and a large content management software. I am leaning toward mx portal because it doesn't touch phpBB at all. I tried the *Nukes and the required hacks and modifications completely destroy the concept of modularity (if there is such a word...).

I am very much of a freak for usability and am a follower of Jacob Nielsen, as much as possible. I do understand the need for a slight "appeal" but not too much.

So. I have the unique topic. I also have the software. I need to do some touch-up to make it look appealing and more "flowing". this part I am not too good at. I am a propeller-head, not a fashion designer .

Once the site is up and working as I want it, I will get a new domain name, and deploy it on there.

Am I missing any key elements in the process? Do I have my head backwards?

I do know I WILL need eye candy experts to mess up the site, just don't know who can.

p.s.: I have been running a closed online community for over five years reasonably successfully. It is not profitable, it is not fancy, and definitely for techies. But it is a running community.

p.p.s.: Why have I popsted it here on DaniWeb? Because I have searched the web for various phpBB related, web site deployment, etc. discussion groups and this site seem to have the most relevant posts.
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Junior Poster
Libertate is offline Offline
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since Jan 2005
Jan 29th, 2005
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Re: Concept to fruition - the chronicle of a new site

Thanks,

I enjoyed reading that. And many of the steps you outlined are similar to what I have in mind for my own little hobby of a website

I'm trying to read up on Jakob Nielson now.

I was about to ask about your online community but I just noticed it's "closed" .. ah well.

Good luck and I'd like to know of more developments.

Ciao for now.
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Newbie Poster
ramwire is offline Offline
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since Jan 2005
Jan 29th, 2005
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Re: Concept to fruition - the chronicle of a new site

Good luck with your venture, though I'd recommend vBulletin if you're looking for something professional.

You'll probably need to do some advertising, either paid for free advertising.
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Junior Poster
Danny is offline Offline
193 posts
since May 2004
Jan 30th, 2005
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Re: Concept to fruition - the chronicle of a new site

Quote originally posted by Danny ...
Good luck with your venture, though I'd recommend vBulletin if you're looking for something professional.

You'll probably need to do some advertising, either paid for free advertising.
Danny, why do you think vBulleting is "more professional" then phpBB?
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Junior Poster
Libertate is offline Offline
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since Jan 2005
Jan 30th, 2005
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Re: Concept to fruition - the chronicle of a new site

Quote originally posted by Libertate ...
Danny, why do you think vBulleting is "more professional" then phpBB?
From my experience, as a generalization (although there are certainly exceptions) vBulletin comes off as much more professional.

Here is exactly why -- Money tends to screen out the newbies and the uneducated. People who are prepared to pay $85 or $160 tend to be more serious about what they are doing.

I'm generally more apt to join a community running vB with 100 members than a phpBB community with the same amount -- because I know at the vB site I'll generally find more active admins, etc.

The same concept follows through in the inverse. I'd be willing to bet you'll find much less spam from members at WebHostingTalk.com who pay for the site's "Premium Membership" feature than those who are free members. The same is probably true at Daniweb.

So, as my suggestion stands, if you're looking to start a community, and are serious about it, put down some money up front. And if in the end, your site doesn't do well, you can sell the license if its owned.
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Junior Poster
Danny is offline Offline
193 posts
since May 2004
Feb 3rd, 2005
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Re: Concept to fruition - the chronicle of a new site

Quote originally posted by Danny ...
From my experience, as a generalization (although there are certainly exceptions) vBulletin comes off as much more professional.
Well, I have taken some time to review the vBulletin forums, and discussions. The fact that there is open discussions on supporting vBulletin for money is already a plus. I have tried to start a forum on phpBB, and you would think I asked them to re-write the code in .ASP or something... :rolleyes:

I just wanted one forum, where phpBB users, whom are willing to PAY for MODs & hacks, could post their requirest, and the professionals, MOD and hack developers could PM back to the poster. No dice. :cry:

There are also several more modifications available to vBulletin then to phpBB. One of my major problems with phpBB was the lack of default/built-in feature to add profile fields, then flag them as public/visible or private/hidden.

My only concern is with vBulletin (other then the price), is how the modifications are implemented. Are they all manual in the files, or is there a tool, similar to phpBB's EasyMOD?

I do not thin vBulletin and phpBB looks that much different from the user's perspective so my only other concern is how easy to add non-vBulletin pages with the vBulletin look/feel "engine/template/skin"? I seen a few "portal or CMS tools, but I cannot try them out since I cannot install vBulletin, without buying it. Any suggestions on this?
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Junior Poster
Libertate is offline Offline
120 posts
since Jan 2005
Feb 12th, 2005
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Re: Concept to fruition - the chronicle of a new site

I think I am pretty much set on vBulletin as the solution for this community web site.

Now for the domain name - I need some sort of an identity.

Is there a tool out there that can find short, as short as possible, domain names, using a list of thoughts, words, synonyms, etc. to generate a domain name?
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Junior Poster
Libertate is offline Offline
120 posts
since Jan 2005
Feb 18th, 2005
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Re: Concept to fruition - the chronicle of a new site

Well, I am stuck.

I cannot get anyone to answer my questions on vBulletin.org, and of course vBulletin.com won't answer.

The questions are
  • "compatibility" of various hacks
  • Best CMS for
    • compatibility with other hacks,
    • and most plugins,
    • and easiest to re-install in new versions of vBulletin.

Any suggestions? I am willing to drop the owned price, but it is driving me nuts that I can't even see the hacks' screen shots. That is ridiculuous! How am I supposed to decide if vBulletin is the right choice if I can't see it? I am not asking for the code...
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Junior Poster
Libertate is offline Offline
120 posts
since Jan 2005
Feb 18th, 2005
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Re: Concept to fruition - the chronicle of a new site

I can't offer much assistance as far as the vBulletin community is concerned, but I can say that vB is an excellent choice. It powers this forum, and my PHP knowledge along with how extensible the code is, has allowed me to build blogs, a code snippet section, tutorials, a portal, and a link directory on top of the vBulletin core system.
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The Queen of DaniWeb
cscgal is offline Offline
13,646 posts
since Feb 2002
Feb 21st, 2005
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Re: Concept to fruition - the chronicle of a new site

Quote originally posted by cscgal ...
I can't offer much assistance as far as the vBulletin community is concerned, but I can say that vB is an excellent choice. It powers this forum, and my PHP knowledge along with how extensible the code is, has allowed me to build blogs, a code snippet section, tutorials, a portal, and a link directory on top of the vBulletin core system.
Unfortunatelly I cannot rely on my own PHP knowledge, albeit I could do it. I am not interested in coding or making major changes by myself.

On a different note, searching for their return policy and support agreement I realized that they have no return policy. They decide "case by case". As a business, anything non-concrete non-defined scares me. While searching for the refund policy, I have also read some of threads on their license enforcement problems, whereby representatives of theirs contacted the ISP directly to remove a site, which turned out to be a valid license. A serious problem and potentially costly for a business.

Sudenly vBulletin doesn't look so hot... I am revisiting other GPL/free forums with CMS/Portal to see if they can do the job...
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Junior Poster
Libertate is offline Offline
120 posts
since Jan 2005

This thread is more than three months old

No one has posted to this discussion for at least three months. Please let old threads die and do not reply to them unless you feel you have something new and valuable to contribute that absolutely must be added to make the discussion complete. Otherwise, please start a new thread in this forum instead.
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