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Apr 28th, 2009

Re: True Random Number Generator

The point is not to use an algoritham to generate random numbers it it to generate TRUE random numbers forinsance the radiation around you is argubly random and the sound waves genereated around you are seemingly random so using sound could i not generate random numbers !

kelechi96

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Apr 28th, 2009

Re: True Random Number Generator

> A computer is only able to generate pseudo-random numbers, if you want real random numbers: just let the user move the mouse across the screen (in a completely random way

)
> From the mouse movement you can generate a (real?) random number

tux4life

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Apr 28th, 2009

Re: True Random Number Generator

Click to Expand / Collapse Quote originally posted by kelechi96 ...

seemingly random

there's your problem: nothing is truly random. some things are just less predictable than others.

the fact is, you're never goign to generate truly random numbers, even if something like that existed. so be happy with the commercially available pseudo-random number generators, like the rest of the world.

if you're doing something that needs more than that, then you're working for the NSA and shouldnt be trolling Daniweb for your answers.

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Apr 28th, 2009

Re: True Random Number Generator

An example of this would be to measure the amount of electrical energy in the air at any given point using some sort of analog device, which then converts this into a voltage difference, which is then converted to a digital value (usually between 0 and 4096) to represent the voltage in the air, within a given limit. This value is real world, and while not random, will fluctuate seemingly randomly (if measured in a small enough scale ie micro volts). If used as a seed for a pre-existing random function (like rand() ) this will generate the most random numbers a person can hope to generate via electrons. Using a sound file is overkill in this sense, as the direct input voltage value from the microphone should suffice, and save you a fair bit of math/sonic calculating.

skatamatic

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Apr 28th, 2009

Re: True Random Number Generator

Click to Expand / Collapse Quote originally posted by skatamatic ...

An example of this blah blah blah at any given point using some sort of analog device

or maybe you could sprinkle some magic fairy dust, and use some "sort of analog device" to aggregate the quantum velocities of the fairies at any given point according to Heisenfairy's Uncertainty Principle.

or you could just say fook it, and thow Schroedinger's cat into a lorenz attractor and save yourself a fair bit of math/sonic calculating, and call it 50/50.

Last edited by jephthah; Apr 28th, 2009 at 7:17 pm.

jephthah

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Apr 28th, 2009

Re: True Random Number Generator

>...then you're working for the NSA...
That's it! (see my the 1st post in the thread above

.

"Unpredictable" or "non-reproducible" sequences (it's not the same as "random") are used for generating of forgery-resistant keys in cryptography (as usually with special external devices). In actual fact an ordinar desktop computer can generate some kind of (low-quality) "unpredictable" sequences. However it's not so simple work.

I think for non-critical applications (like OP

) no need in methods like soundtrecks and other exotics. Get keystrokes trace (with millisecond oprecision intervals), calc SHA1 digest of this trace - that's 160 "unpredictable" bytes. Take into account that OP did not define any "randomness" criteria so any one solution is not worse that any others

...

Let me repeat myself: more advanced methods are a valued know-how and Daniweb is not the best place to discuss them

...

ArkM

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Apr 28th, 2009

Re: True Random Number Generator

Click to Expand / Collapse Quote originally posted by skatamatic ...

An example of this would be to measure the amount of electrical energy in the air at any given point using some sort of analog device, which then converts this into a voltage difference, which is then converted to a digital value (usually between 0 and 4096) to represent the voltage in the air, within a given limit. This value is real world, and while not random, will fluctuate seemingly randomly (if measured in a small enough scale ie micro volts). If used as a seed for a pre-existing random function (like rand() ) this will generate the most random numbers a person can hope to generate via electrons. Using a sound file is overkill in this sense, as the direct input voltage value from the microphone should suffice, and save you a fair bit of math/sonic calculating.

See this is the awnser I was looking for THANK YOU +rep but how do i do this ?

kelechi96

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Apr 28th, 2009

Re: True Random Number Generator

Click to Expand / Collapse Quote originally posted by jephthah ...

or maybe you could sprinkle some magic fairy dust, and use some "sort of analog device" to aggregate the quantum velocities of the fairies at any given point according to Heisenfairy's Uncertainty Principle.

or you could just say fook it, and thow Schroedinger's cat into a lorenz attractor and save yourself a fair bit of math/sonic calculating, and call it 50/50.

.

Dude that wasn't nice or fair sure you outrank me but that was bang out of order this is why these communitys are set up to try and get away from the ridicule of the "populer" comunity sure im 13 but i want to learn I actuly understood that and its a brillient methord please don't flame a good awnser or daniweb the most "friendly" comunity becomes daniweb the most friendly comunity if you do what jephthah thinks is good

kelechi96

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Apr 28th, 2009

Re: True Random Number Generator

Click to Expand / Collapse Quote originally posted by jephthah ...

or maybe you could sprinkle some magic fairy dust, and use some "sort of analog device" to aggregate the quantum velocities of the fairies at any given point according to Heisenfairy's Uncertainty Principle.

or you could just say fook it, and thow Schroedinger's cat into a lorenz attractor and save yourself a fair bit of math/sonic calculating, and call it 50/50.

.

Umm...What point was made, exactly, with that post?

and kelechi96,
don't get discouraged too much, some of the people around here can be a little ignorant at times, but will usually help you out if you are willing to tolerate it.

skatamatic

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Apr 28th, 2009

Re: True Random Number Generator

>>An example of this would be to measure the amount of electrical energy in
>>the air at any given point using some sort of analog device, which then
>>converts this into a voltage difference, which is then converted to a digital
>>value (usually between 0 and 4096) to represent the voltage in the air, within
>> a given limit.
Thanks for enlighting our minds. But could do tell how will you implement this 'magical' apparatus.

>>See this is the awnser I was looking for THANK YOU +rep but how do i do this ?
Wow, were you?
Ask him. I am no magician.
I doubt if you need that extreme randomness.

>>Umm...What point was made, exactly, with that post?
The same point which you made by yours. He just increased the randomness by a million times.

Last edited by siddhant3s; Apr 28th, 2009 at 8:18 pm.

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