New font size

[John A]

I don't like it one bit. If I had problems with my eyesight, I'd increase the font size on my browser.

Please change it back...

[Dani]

I received some complaints in the past that the font size was too small. So I figured I'd run an experiment for a couple of days and see what the reaction is. It turns out that both CNET and MSN are actually using this same larger font size for their articles, so there must be some value in it. We'll see. I'm actually interested to see if there is a correlation between font size and the tendancy of a user to spend less / longer periods of time browsing each individual page. Eyestrain tends to be a major problem with forum systems, especially when the goal is to browse a significant number of pages in a single session.

[christina>you]

Yeah, I don't like the font size either. I liked it much better the other way.

[Dani]

May I ask for you to explain with specific reasons why you don't like it? ie is it just aesthetically unpleasing, does the larger font size require too much scrolling, do you find it's easier or harder on the eyes? Would a comprimise be to keep the larger size for the blog entries and tutorials but revert to the smaller size for the forums?

[christina>you]

Umm.. I would say it does require too much scrolling.. and it's definitely harder on the eyes. I guess I'm just used to the smaller font. I'm not really picky about the blog entries and tutorials but I would like to keep the smaller size on the forums.

[John A]

Agreed with Christina, it takes too much scrolling, and the font size has a "in your face" feeling. I can understand it more for blogs because it's more news-oriented (although I tend to prefer the small size on blogs too).

[~s.o.s~]

Believe it or not, even if this font size looks bad, this is more like it. And btw Joey, 90% of the people don't think of increasing the size of their browser font, and end up reading as it is. Look at Devshed or any other professional site out there, its the same standard followed out there.

Though the font size is good, I think trying out a new font face would be not a problem for you, atleast for a day or even an hour. If you have decided to tweak, why not tweak it to the core.

Oh and btw Dani, if you haven't noticed, even the text area for typing on those sites hosts the same font as the font which is used for display. It feels weird to be typing in verdana 8pt, to see your quick reply rendered in 8pt and after refreshing your posts in 10pt verdana. Not really consistent, is it?

[Dani]

sos ... I'm confused by your reply. Are you pro or con? :) What do you mean by "even if this font size looks bad, this is more like it"?

I'll follow through should I decide to keep the font change, but for now, one change at a time - I don't want complaints about how I'm now using a larger font size in the smaller quick reply box!

[tgreer]

A bigger font, against a white background, tends to make the font look "lighter" in color. Smaller fonts look darker, so are more legible. If you're going to up the point size, which is fine, try making the text a shade or so darker.

Leading (space between lines) is also important to readability.

Note: I've worked in printing, and typography, and font technologies, for many years. For these types of issues, I recommend The Complete Manual of Typography.

Online, I recommend A List Apart for style advice. Notice they use a smaller font, but they use black (not gray).

[christina>you]

I use firefox, so I guess I'll just make the font size smaller, manually. =/

[~s.o.s~]

sos ... I'm confused by your reply. Are you pro or con? :) What do you mean by "even if this font size looks bad, this is more like it"?

I meant, even though it doesn't look pleasing (aesthetic), the current font goes easy on the eyes and makes reading the posts a breeze. And I also agree with Thomas, a little more reasearch into font faces to bring out a pleasing combination of font size and color would be more like it.

> I use firefox, so I guess I'll just make the font size smaller, manually. =/
Though this would wreck your display when visiting other sites. But since you don't browse a lot, I guess it should be OK.

[Dani]

I made the font size a shade darker, per tgreer's recommendation. Still unsure whether I'll keep this or go back to the old way.

I'm getting very mixed opinions. joeprogrammer and Christina like the old font better. tgreer told me via IM he prefers the larger size. And now you, sos, are telling me the easier way is easier on the eyes and a breeze to read - which could go a long way towards making the forums "sticky".

[christina>you]

> I use firefox, so I guess I'll just make the font size smaller, manually. =/
Though this would wreck your display when visiting other sites. But since you don't browse a lot, I guess it should be OK.

Actually, it doesn't interfere with any other sites.

[Duki]

Hm, I don't mind it though users with smaller monitors may have a scrolling issue. I find it to be easier on the eyes myself.

I think a lot of it is just the change of it... give it a week or so and then if people complain maybe it's a problem... I agree, it sort of feels akward, but I'm sure once I get used to it, I will appreciate the change.

[Dani]

Chalk another one up for being easier on the eyes.

[Duki]

Yeah... i really do like the small font on everything else though. Larger fonts just tend to improve readability.

[Dani]

I went ahead and increased the font size (to be consistant) for the wysiwyg editor. I wasn't going to go ahead and do this until I had my mind made up, but there's no point in doing a half-assed test and getting half-assed results.

[~s.o.s~]

And now you, sos, are telling me the easier way is easier on the eyes and a breeze to read - which could go a long way towards making the forums "sticky".

Yes reading it sure is a breeze. Keep trying out different changes with your stylesheets (font face, color, size) and ask the people to give their feedback. How about doing something like this:

Style 1: (verdana, 10pt)

• blah blah blah

Style 2: (arial, 9pt)

• blah blah blah

Keeping this and letting us judge or make comments on the fonts which you think are suitable for the site. Can you embed different font's on the same page just for the sake of evaluation.

[Duki]

meh, i like the small font for everything else... just reading larger fonts makes it easier. impo

[Dani]

Duki, knowing how these sorta DaniWeb discussions sometimes get heated, are you sure that you want to take a different side than Christina?

[Dani]

sos, I am really pretty happy with the fonts we use overall and am really just concerned with 11px versus 12px for post bodies, tutorial bodies, and blog bodies. All other fonts are remaining the same.

[christina>you]

Duki, knowing how these sorta DaniWeb discussions sometimes get heated, are you sure that you want to take a different side than Christina?

Eh... he always takes a different side than me... I'm used to it. ;)

[~s.o.s~]

sos, I am really pretty happy with the fonts we use overall and am really just concerned with 11px versus 12px for post bodies, tutorial bodies, and blog bodies. All other fonts are remaining the same.

The font for the quick reply box has not changed, and so has the font for quoted text. The contrast between normal text and quoted text is too much. Not to mention that the font size for the inlinecode has adjusted to the change while the normal code enclosed in the code tags is still of the previous font size. Please do away with the inconsistency.

[Dave Sinkula]

What is the font face?

[]My impression was first ??? Then, m'kay my eyesight sucks and this helps. And then, is this a new font?[]

If it's either Tahoma or Verdana, that's one thing that's always bugged me about both: they don't look quite right in an off sizing.

[/Hmm=just another adjustment]

[~s.o.s~]

Font face is a HTML lingo. <font face="verdana" size="10" color="red">Here the font face is verdana</font> And yes, I guess this is 10 or 11 pt Verdana.

[Dani]

> The font for the quick reply box has not changed
I am afraid that increasing the font size here will lead to an uproar regarding the recently reduced quick reply box. I want to deal with one change at a time. However, I did darken the font in the wysiwyg editor and set up a little bit of line spacing for easier reading. With that said, I'm not sure it's entirely necessary for the wysiwyg editor text to be the same size as the actual post. I'm sure there are members (I happen to be one of them) who appreciate the slightly smaller text size in exchange for being able to fit more text into the quick reply.

> The contrast between normal text and quoted text is too much
The entire site consistently reuses a limited selection of font styles, and the smaller size found in the quotes is found in many other places throughout the page, so I don't think it stands out as being awkwardly small. I would prefer that quoted text take the least amount of room as possible because, in most cases, it is redundant text which is repeated in regular style elsewhere on the same page.

> Not to mention that the font size for the inlinecode has adjusted to the change while the normal code enclosed in the code tags is still of the previous font size
Both inline code and regular code should be of the smaller font size. I thought that the fixed font looked too awkward at the larger size, and I don't think it's necessary.

In conclusion, everything regarding this entire thread is still up in the air at the moment. Still playing it by eat and constantly checking statistics and getting opinions regarding visibility and ease of reading.

[Dani]

Everything on the page has remained the same except actual article bodies and post bodies have been replaced with 12px Verdana from 11px Verdana. (Note px and not pt ... I find specifying font sizes in px via CSS makes things more consistent among browsers and platforms.)

[Dani]

> Then, m'kay my eyesight sucks and this helps.
So can this be interpreted as one more vote to keep it?

[joshSCH]

> Then, m'kay my eyesight sucks and this helps.
So can this be interpreted as one more vote to keep it?

haha every1 is always complaining about something.. You can't get every1 to like the same thing.. I like it, I think we should keep it:)

[John A]

haha every1 is always complaining about something.. You can't get every1 to like the same thing.. I like it, I think we should keep it

Maybe it's just me. Or maybe it's the forum style constantly changing that bugs me.

I don't really know. When I first came here to DaniWeb, the theme seemed decent. A year later, I still think it's (more or less) decent. It doesn't seem that much better than when I first came here.