Can Barack Obama save America? - Page 2

[GrimJack]

"Can Barack Obama save America?"

hahaha<snip>haha

Is that a joke? If anything, Obama will DESTROY America. He's a manipulative socialist bastard...

You have no clue what a socialist is so how do you get off calling anyone with a label you can not define?

Obama will expand government every chance he gets.

Er, wtf do you think Bush and his conservatives did?

He will use our current economic recession to his advantage much in the way that Adolf Hitler did in the 30s.

Heh,heh - Hitler - heh,heh don't be a doody-head; Hitler is supposed to be the last resort of an idiot without a clue, not the first attempt.

He will destroy our economy, ruin our overseas reputation, destroy our alliances, and ultimately kill the American way-of-life as we know it.

Bush has already done all that - Obama is here to save America from the Bush era.

[joshSCH]

You have no clue what a socialist is so how do you get off calling anyone with a label you can not define?

What? Who says I dont know what a socialist is? You? Thanks, but I can see for myself. Your puny mind has been brainwashed by the Great Messiah.

Er, wtf do you think Bush and his conservatives did?

Why do you always involve Bush into every conversation? Did I say anything about Bush? For all you know, I dislike Bush. Assuming someone aligns himself with a political party simply because he dislikes the other candidate is naive.

Heh,heh - Hitler - heh,heh don't be a doody-head; Hitler is supposed to be the last resort of an idiot without a clue, not the first attempt. Bush has already done all that - Obama is here to save America from the Bush era.

LOL. A doody-head, huh? Why, because you cant see the same parallels now as existed in Germany post-WW2? You are a fool. Your optimistic thinking, and blind faith in someone makes you so. You probably know NOTHING about Obama aside from what the lefty media tells you. I suggest that you use that tiny brain of yours and actual do a bit of research.

Obama is ALREADY accelerating both government and our national debt at a rate far greater than Bush did during his 8 years. Obama and the Liberal's TARP plan failed miserably just like their stupid "stimulus" bill will. We do not NEED government intervention: fiscal policy has never worked, and never will.

Also, note how the two biggest portion of our debt is due to Liberal politics: Medicare and Social Security. Wow, what an intelligent idea!

When Ronald Reagan took office, the economy was in an arguably worse state than it is now. However, his strives to limit government, and leave the private sector alone helped us to recover, and enjoy the prosperities of the 90s. Obama plans to do the very opposite... Hmmm.... I wonder what will happen...

[Ancient Dragon]

When Ronald Reagan took office, the economy was in an arguably worse state than it is now. However, his strives to limit government, and leave the private sector alone helped us to recover, and enjoy the prosperities of the 90s. Obama plans to do the very opposite... Hmmm.... I wonder what will happen...

As much as I liked Reagan -- his policies of limited government seemed like a good idea at the time, but evidentally failed. We are now seeing the results of that policy and similar deregulation.

[sneekula]

...
When Ronald Reagan took office, the economy was in an arguably worse state than it is now. However, his strives to limit government, and leave the private sector alone helped us to recover, and enjoy the prosperities of the 90s. Obama plans to do the very opposite... Hmmm.... I wonder what will happen...

Reagan presided over the largest US deficit increase and tax increase ever. He also sold arms to our enemy Iran (Iran Contra affair), an item he conveniently could not remember doing.

[joshSCH]

As much as I liked Reagan -- his policies of limited government seemed like a good idea at the time, but evidentally failed. We are now seeing the results of that policy and similar deregulation.

Oh, so our abominable economy now is a result of Reagan's failed policies in the 1980s? Aight so then if everything is delayed by 20 years, then we're about to see how Clinton's policies will affect the economy, right? LOL Idiot..

Our economy is the way it is today because of dumbass Liberals. They forced banking institutions to give risky loans to poor people who could not pay them back.. They allowed Fannie/Freddie to function freely without regulation, and ultimately fucked us all over simply to give some dumbass poor people who are living on welfare a 10,000 square foot home.

Reagan presided over the largest US deficit increase and tax increase ever. He also sold arms to our enemy Iran (Iran Contra affair), an item he conveniently could not remember doing.

Reagan single-handedly took down the Soviet Union by outspending them, and proving to the world the superiority of a market economy v. a command economy. Yeah, wars cost money.

And yes... we did train and give weaponry to the Taliban in hopes of them rising up against our former enemies- such as the Soviets.. Not a smart thing to do, but now Obama just wants us to sit back while they nuke us or fire a devastating EMP at us? ;-)

[MosaicFuneral]

Wow, Iraqis are so crafty turning armored tractors with pesticide turrets into tanks. lol http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kqBOMBSDQsI

[VernonDozier]

simply to give some dumbass poor people who are living on welfare a 10,000 square foot home.

I assume you can give examples of this? Sounds like the mythical Cadillac-driving Chicago welfare queen urban legend.

[GrimJack]

I assume you can give examples of this? Sounds like the mythical Cadillac-driving Chicago welfare queen urban legend.

And to bring this back to Reagan - that was the senile old fart "specialized in the exaggerated, outrageous tale that was almost always unsubstantiated, usually false, yet so sensational that it merited repeated recounting… And because his ‘examples’ of welfare queens drew on existing stereotypes of welfare cheats and resonated with news stories about welfare fraud, they did indeed gain real traction." He sold missiles to Iran within 2 years of Iran's release of the hostages (was he fulfilling his part of a bargain). He supported terrorists in South America even after laws were passed to prevent it.

[Aia]

Yes we can, yes we can.

[GrimJack]

What? Who says I dont know what a socialist is? You? Thanks, but I can see for myself. Your puny mind has been brainwashed by the Great Messiah.

Then define socialist. You have been brain-washed by the drug-addled, sausage Rush and his constant worrying about "bend over and grab ankles"

Why do you always involve Bush into every conversation? Did I say anything about Bush? For all you know, I dislike Bush. Assuming someone aligns himself with a political party simply because he dislikes the other candidate is naive.

You were attempting to denigrate Obama about ruining the economy so I mentioned that Bush already did that. No one gives a rat's butt whether or not you like Bush (now - I am betting you were a strong supporter until it was no longer a popular position). I have no clue what you are talking about wrt 'naive'.

LOL. A doody-head, huh? Why, because you cant see the same parallels now as existed in Germany post-WW2? You are a fool.

No, I think you are a doody-head because you can not come up with anything original and need to echo right-wing talking points. If you are going to make such a comparison, you should at least have the intellectual honesty to try to back up your comparison.

Your optimistic thinking, and blind faith in someone makes you so. You probably know NOTHING about Obama aside from what the lefty media tells you. I suggest that you use that tiny brain of yours and actual do a bit of research.

Woohoo - I have a tiny brain and do not do research and am an optimist and yet, and yet you can not even support the least of your opinions.

Obama is ALREADY accelerating both government and our national debt at a rate far greater than Bush did during his 8 years.

Nope, not even close. Unemployment went from 4.2% when Bush started to 7.2% when he left, and jobs are still going away. Job growth under Bush was the worst in 70 years.

Obama and the Liberal's TARP plan failed miserably just like their stupid "stimulus" bill will. We do not NEED government intervention: fiscal policy has never worked, and never will.

The TARP was Bush's brainchild - it was his administration that came up with the brilliant idea to give the banks 750 billion dollars with no accounting.

Also, note how the two biggest portion of our debt is due to Liberal politics: Medicare and Social Security. Wow, what an intelligent idea!

Not even close to the truth - where the hell do you get your data. I want links; come on - support your statements!

When Ronald Reagan took office, the economy was in an arguably worse state than it is now. However, his strives to limit government, and leave the private sector alone helped us to recover, and enjoy the prosperities of the 90s. Obama plans to do the very opposite... Hmmm.... I wonder what will happen...

When Reagan took office, the national debt was 900 billion dollars; when Reagan left office 2800 Billion dollars. In "Reagan's Liberal Legacy" Joshua Green lays out the argument that "many of his actions as president wound up facilitating liberal objectives." Look: Reagan acceded to tax increases, oversaw a large increase in the size of the federal government, and made peace with the Soviet Union. All you conservative dreamers (is that an oxymoron or what!!) just can't grasp the realities of the world.
One year after his massive tax cut, Reagan agreed to a tax increase to reduce the deficit that restored fully one-third of the previous year's reduction.
Faced with looming deficits, Reagan raised taxes again in 1983 with a gasoline tax and once more in 1984, this time by $50 billion over three years, mainly through closing tax loopholes for business. Despite the fact that such increases were anathema to conservatives--and probably cost Reagan's successor, George H.W. Bush, reelection--Reagan raised taxes a grand total of four times just between 1982-84.
The number of Federal workers increased by 61,000 under Reagan (compare to 373,000 Federal jobs cut under Clinton)

I will supply sources when you do.

[WaltP]

Also, note how the two biggest portion of our debt is due to Liberal politics: Medicare and Social Security. Wow, what an intelligent idea!

Not even close to the truth - where the hell do you get your data. I want links; come on - support your statements!

1945            [B]Harry Truman[/B] sends a message to Congress [B]asking for[/B]
                legislation establishing a national health insurance 
                plan.  Two decades of debate ensue, with opponents
                warning of the dangers of [B]"socialized medicine."[/B]
...
July 30, 1965   [B]Medicare and its companion program Medicaid[/B],
                (which insures indigent recipients), [B]are signed into 
                law by President Lyndon Johnson[/B] as part of his 
                "Great Society."

                Ex-president Truman is the first to enroll in Medicare.

http://seniorjournal.com/NEWS/2000%20Files/Aug%2000/FTR-08-04-00MedCarHistry.htm
AFAIK, Truman and Johnson were not conservatives. Aren't Democrats known as liberals?

Franklin Delano Roosevelt (January 30, 1882 – April 12, 1945), often referred to by his initials FDR, was the 32nd President of the United States. He was a central figure of the 20th century during a time of worldwide economic crisis and world war. Elected to four terms in office, he served from 1933 to 1945 and is the only U.S. president to have served more than two terms.

During the Great Depression of the 1930s, Roosevelt created the New Deal to provide relief for the unemployed, recovery of the economy, and reform of the economic and banking systems, through various agencies, such as the Works Project Administration (WPA), National Recovery Administration (NRA), and the Agricultural Adjustment Administration (AAA).[1] Although recovery of the economy was incomplete until World War II, several programs he initiated, such as the Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation (FDIC), Tennessee Valley Authority (TVA), and the United States Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC), continue to have instrumental roles in the nation's commerce. [B]Some of his other legacies include the Social Security system[/B] and the National Labor Relations Board (NLRB).

And another Democrat -- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Franklin_D._Roosevelt

OK, there you have links.

[GrimJack]

1945            [B]Harry Truman[/B] sends a message to Congress [B]asking for[/B]
                legislation establishing a national health insurance 
                plan.  Two decades of debate ensue, with opponents
                warning of the dangers of [B]"socialized medicine."[/B]
...
July 30, 1965   [B]Medicare and its companion program Medicaid[/B],
                (which insures indigent recipients), [B]are signed into 
                law by President Lyndon Johnson[/B] as part of his 
                "Great Society."

                Ex-president Truman is the first to enroll in Medicare.

http://seniorjournal.com/NEWS/2000%20Files/Aug%2000/FTR-08-04-00MedCarHistry.htm
AFAIK, Truman and Johnson were not conservatives. Aren't Democrats known as liberals?

Franklin Delano Roosevelt (January 30, 1882 – April 12, 1945), often referred to by his initials FDR, was the 32nd President of the United States. He was a central figure of the 20th century during a time of worldwide economic crisis and world war. Elected to four terms in office, he served from 1933 to 1945 and is the only U.S. president to have served more than two terms.

During the Great Depression of the 1930s, Roosevelt created the New Deal to provide relief for the unemployed, recovery of the economy, and reform of the economic and banking systems, through various agencies, such as the Works Project Administration (WPA), National Recovery Administration (NRA), and the Agricultural Adjustment Administration (AAA).[1] Although recovery of the economy was incomplete until World War II, several programs he initiated, such as the Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation (FDIC), Tennessee Valley Authority (TVA), and the United States Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC), continue to have instrumental roles in the nation's commerce. [B]Some of his other legacies include the Social Security system[/B] and the National Labor Relations Board (NLRB).

And another Democrat -- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Franklin_D._Roosevelt

OK, there you have links.

Thanks, but -um- I know who the liberals are; I am not questioning who the liberals are.

Let me spell it out for you - The United States owes the Social Security system over a trillion dollars. Does this help you?

Also, note how the two biggest portion of our debt is due to Liberal politics: Medicare and Social Security. Wow, what an intelligent idea!

So, let us look at the statement again. So, I step you through my thought process:
How can Medicare and Social Security be the 2 biggest portions of our debt when Social Security by itself has taken in over a trillion dollars that has been borrowed to make the budget look better. It is not a hole in the budget - it fills the holes in the budget.

[ahihihi...]

Let's vote GrimJack for U.S.Pres.

[Ancient Dragon]

Let's vote GrimJack for U.S.Pres.

I wanted to vote for Superman, but sadly he died a couple years ago.

[GrimJack]

I wanted to vote for Superman, but sadly he died a couple years ago.

Didn't he get beat to death by Batman?

[ahihihi...]

Can GrimJack save US?..

OKAY .. I'll go for Super old geek.. :) ahihihihi..

Ihate his victory statement.. "I'm asking you to believe.. not just in my ability to bring about real change in W .. I'm asking you to believe in yours.."

how 'bout you? old geek?.. :) what's your statement?..

[sneekula]

Whenever Obama does something, I think of what McCain with the help of Palin would have done.

[Aia]

Whenever Obama does something, I think of what McCain with the help of Palin would have done.

If I understand your insinuation correctly: it doesn't matter how bad he does, still it would have been worse with a McCain/Palin administration.
What a pathetic and flawed reasoning that is!

Give credit and judgment to a person for what [s]he does, and not for what you think [s]he would do. The deeds and actions so far are there for everyone to see; no pretty words can camouflage the doing, no flattering promises can change his choices.

I am afraid I am throwing pearls to the swines, since I doubt you care about it.

[sneekula]

We have been throwing pearls to the swines for eight years, look what we got!

[GrimJack]

And Aia has been throwing swine before pearls for years now - if only he could read his own lips:

Give credit and judgment to a person for what [s]he does, and not for what you think [s]he would do.

[sneekula]

Using the present policies, I would say no!
The folks who ran the banks for many years are still robbing them with bonuses and awards they voted for themselves. These things are simply not performance based, or they would go way negative!

The next big shoe to drop will be the Credit Cards!

If we ever come out of this mess that was many years in the making, we will see a mildly different world. A few things that will change:

Cars and expressways are the transportation solution.
A home is a good investment.
It is easy to find a new job locally.
There is too much farmland, let's pave it over with malls and streets.
Life in the suburb is nice and crime free.
The police will protect my wealth.
The stockmarket will go up over the long run.
The folks that run a bank deserve their bonuses and awards.
My credit rating is high and will always be that way.
My health care is good and will always be good.
Pension funds will take care of my old age needs.
Social Security is fundamentally sound.
My children will have a better life than I do.

[sneekula]

It is the got-to-have-it-today mentality of the US consumers that elected our politicians. Why are we surprised that any solution coming from Washington is all about spending too much and saving too little.

[Ancient Dragon]

>>Cars and expressways are the transportation solution.
[/code]
They already are -- I have not walked to work in many many years.

>>A home is a good investment.
It has always been, and will probably always be. And its a good investment even today. Just don't try to sell the house and you have lost nothing.

>>There is too much farmland, let's pave it over with malls and streets.
And how do you think we will grow our food if all farmland is converted to shopping malls?

>>Life in the suburb is nice and crime free.
Utopia:)

>>The police will protect my wealth.
Its not the job of the police to protect you our your wealth.

>>The folks that run a bank deserve their bonuses and awards.
Yea, suuuure they will :) :)

>>My credit rating is high and will always be that way.
Credit rating is unimportant -- no long will buy anything with credit.

>> My health care is good and will always be good.
If you are talking about universal health care, it'd better be great for the price we'd pay. Our taxes will proabaly double just to pay for it.

>>Pension funds will take care of my old age needs.
They do that now.

>>Social Security is fundamentally sound.
There is nothing wrong with SS now, and never has been. The problem is congress stealing the money from SS funds to pay for other things. I read somewhere else that the us government ows SS funds over $1Trillion from such thefts.

>>My children will have a better life than I do.
Hopefully, yes.

[Ancient Dragon]

how 'bout you? old geek?.. :) what's your statement?..

You don't want to know because you wouldn't like it.

[vegaseat]

Did Obama cause the drop in the US stockmarket?
Maybe, there was a similar drop in 2002 after W took over.

It still doesn't explain why the Japanese stockmarket went through the same decline a few months earlier.

[GrimJack]

So! What is the latest complaint from teabagging rightwingers?
What has the POTUS done recently to put your panties in a twist?

[suddenzero]

The Answer is No! It wasn't just the Bush administration who caused this mess it has been years and years of failed policy that has caused the failing economy! The problem is the lack of educated voters leads to the election of the wrong officials. This leads to the induction of poor laws which in turn leads to where we are today.

The solution is to educate people better so they make better decisions which will lead to the election of people who can make a difference. My only fear is that it may be too late.

I am getting ready to start an organization to try and get the ball rolling. There are many people that have tried to do the same and failed but I like Obama have an advantage. I am unknown therefore there are not a lot of predisposed opinions about me like many of my predecessors.

For more on my organization go to <snipped url> Please note that this site is still under construction but it will be completed soon.

[Aia]

You made a couple of comments worth looking some more into.

The solution is to educate people better so they make better decisions which will lead to the election of people who can make a difference.

It usually translates into this: if you vote like I want you to vote you are educated in the matter, if you vote opposite you don't know what you are doing. ( it doesn't matter who uses that rhetoric )

There are only two kind of people at election time. Those that care about their ideas and those that don't. Both are voters with the same privilege and they are educated already in their thoughts.

I am getting ready to start an organization to try and get the ball rolling.

One question: what kind of game do you want to play?

[suddenzero]

What you are saying is not true at all in the context that I was meaning! The uneducated individuals that I was speaking of were individuals like I saw in a recent study that were standing in line to vote and when asked couldn't even identify the United States on an unlabeled map yet, these people are voting on laws? It is those type of uneducated people that make poor decisions which result in the situation that we are in! This is the type of uneducated individuals that I was speaking of! Not of any political slant as I do not affiliate myself with any political party. I vote for laws that I feel best represent the same values as the Constitution and people that I feel will do their best to ad hear to the values of our founding fathers whom wrote the Constitution. I also feel that if you don't like the Constitution and the freedoms that it was trying to preserve then you don't belong in this country! Our rights are violated on a daily basis and probably partly due to these types of uneducated individuals that just lay down and figure oh well it is the government what can we do? The answer is stand up for your rights that our founding fathers risked their lives to establish! Anyone interested in fighting for their rights I urge to take a look at the website I am starting <snip url> . The site is currently under construction but it will soon be finished! We need to take this country back by force if necessary!

God Bless Everyone and God Bless the free U.S.A!

[suddenzero]

As far as game I want to play is concerned, there will be no game! I am one of the people that cares about only one thing the preservation of our rights as citizens of this nation that are being treaded on daily! You might remember these:

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion or prohibiting the free exercise thereof, or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press, or the right of the people to peaceably assemble and to petition the government for a redress of grievances!

Those are your and everyone's first amendment rights! However, the government makes laws against and violates these rights on a daily basis. You Tube is filled with videos of these rights being violated however no one seems to want to do something about it! Everyone just sits by and thinks what can I do? So everyone just sits around and waits for the world to change! What would have happened if Our founding fathers would have waited for England to change? What would have happened if Abraham Lincoln would have waited for the south to change? What would have happened if Martin Luther King would have waited for white people to change? The answer to all of these questions is simple. We would be living in a completely different country! Right now is the time for people to take a stand as our country is being torn apart not just from the outside in but also from the inside out as more illegal aliens are taking jobs from Americans and Aliens with green cards are being brought in as cheap labor as well. All of our markets are drying and the debt continues to grow at an enormous rate! If we don't step back and defend ourselves as our forefathers did then we will fall! Abraham Lincoln once stated that a house divided against itself will not stand and that is exactly what we have right now! Our current administration is not only making deals with but relying on the very powers that our "Democracy" has fought against for years! We don't belong borrowing money from or teaming up with China or any other Communist nation as they are completely on the opposite end of the spectrum of our countries original beliefs!