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I only use the heathen system (iTunes) for converting tracks to MP3 from other formats. Most of my mates use iTunes thus send me ruddy MPA4 coded tracks for use in iTunes only. Thus i convert them using it so i can play them on WMP 11 and on my MP3 player (which i add is NOT an iPod)

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>WMP has the advantage of being able to play movies and also have a
>playlist for these things.
I believe iTunes can play ripped movies (and put them into playlists).

>I only use the heathen system (iTunes)
You previously said that "Well ~ I hate the way iTunes protects all of the music so you can't convert it into MP3 to work on other players", but I noted that iTunes doesn't actually protect music you rip yourself, then you said you disliked the layout of iTunes. Is there anything else? I'm genuinely interested in your dislike of iTunes. :)

And this is a side note, but you can use utilities other than iTunes for converting AAC and other related formats to MP3.

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Well, most of my mates burn CD's onto their computers thus they have the silly iTunes format MPEG4 of summit. but the problem arises when you purchase it off the iTunes store. Now iTunes songs are 79p, compared to 81p from the WMP store thing. BUT, when you buy from the iTunes store, they have the protected versions, which you can only get rid of by burning them to disk through a playlist. AND you can only play them through iTunes, AND you can't send them to anyone else so that they can enjoy your favourite song, which is uber rubbish.
That is why i hate iTunes. The heathen System. Currently WMP is beating iTunes, 9 votes to 7.

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Oh, ok, it's the Digital Rights Management scheme that you hate. Understandable, but I think it's worth pointing out that the Zune's DRM scheme is nearly identical to the one Apple is using at the moment. They ditched their own Plays[not?]ForSure DRM scheme which they had licensed out to other companies, and decided to create a whole new sort of codec for the Zune, which doesn't work with other players and only runs in WMP, as far as I know. Not that it makes much of a difference for you since you're not using a Zune, but I just thought it was interesting. (And I do believe Apple has recently added [or is going to?] a few non-protected albums from EMI.)

>you can't send them to anyone else so that they can enjoy your favourite song
Um, that's not legal. That was the whole point of DRM, to stop people from sharing music they don't own.

What do you think of iTunes, from a purely application perspective?

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i think its slow but it does look pretty nice (although wmp11 is mice too)

i prefer wmp11 i think its interface is easier to navigate plus it does more than itunes does

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itunes is crap. It is a poorly designed program, and completely worthless :p

WMP is much more compatible with other media players, and does not require stupid licenses for every song..

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The only use i can think for iTunes, as i said before, is for converting songs into MP3 format. Although i do find that iTunes has a slightly poorer playback quality when playing from a CD compared to WMP11, is that just me?

And josh, i totaly agree with ur previous post :)
WMP is winning 13 to 7 now ~ keep voting WMP :P

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>i think its slow but it does look pretty nice (although wmp11 is mice too)
Finally, something sensible. Yes, I remember that there was a significant slowdown on Windows compared to iTunes for the Mac or WMP.

>itunes is crap. It is a poorly designed program, and completely worthless
Would you mind elaborating, please? :)

>WMP is much more compatible with other media players
How so?

>does not require stupid licenses for every song..
Just remember that the Zune's licensing scheme is nearly identical to the one Apple's using. So if iPod is heathen, so is Zune :-)

>The only use i can think for iTunes, as i said before, is for converting
>songs into MP3 format.
It's not useful for playing media? Please elaborate.

>Although i do find that iTunes has a slightly poorer playback quality
>when playing from a CD compared to WMP11
Could be. I haven't used WMP's CD player feature enough to know that.

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>WMP is much more compatible with other media players
How so?

WMPs sync facility supports like 99% of players (exceptions being sony and apple)

Itunes sync supports only the ipods

WMP files can be played on most media players. Itunes files (m4a) can be played prettymuch only on ipods

Also WMA is a superior format, it is larger but in terms of size to quality it is much more efficient.

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" >The only use i can think for iTunes, as i said before, is for converting
>songs into MP3 format.
It's not useful for playing media? Please elaborate."
Well i never use it for media playing, i used to when i first got it, then started disliking it because the iTunes store kept crashing, and that started my general hatred for iTunes. I then saw WMP 10 (i used to be on 9 first of all) , so i got 10 and went "Wow this is nice" and have never used iTunes for playing media since. The only times i use it are if i win a free iTunes song/s or have a gift card given to me ~ in which case the songs are quickly converted to WMP compatible files.

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i know itunes in the UK sucks, the video store doesnt sell to UK people, so its mucis only, rendering apple tv and video ipods useless

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Well, they are not 'useless' as you put it mate, they have a use ~ unlike the iPhone which really is useless :P

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>WMPs sync facility supports like 99% of players (exceptions being sony
>and apple)
Ok, I wasn't sure whether Josh was referring to software or physical media players. I'll assume the latter.

>Also WMA is a superior format, it is larger but in terms of size to quality
>it is much more efficient.
Not so sure about that one. Do you have any references?

>Well i never use it for media playing
Then I guess you aren't qualified to make a judgement on an application whose primary purpose is to play media. Granted, the store is a significant part of it, but calling the application rubbish based completely upon the fact that the store crashed for you is ridiculous.

>unlike the iPhone which really is useless
Elaborate. Please. Or don't say anything at all.

>Every Apple product is useless..
I'm beginning to get sick of asking people to elaborate.

Seriously, why does it take so much to find out why people hate something? In this last bit of discussion, the only person who has really detailed exact problems with the player part of iTunes is jbennet.

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haha.. I kinda just love saying how much Apple sucks, because I know you will come to defense! ;)

Not defense. I don't mind at all if someone says Apple sucks (or any company for that matter), I just hope that they have good reasons for saying such a thing.

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Well, most people already own a mobile phone, and most people already own an MP3 of some kind. Therefore, would not combining the two be slightly pointless, seeing as people already have the two as separate things. And having them separate is slightly better, because you may not want ur MP3 player if you are going into a meeting all day. While with the iPhone you will always have a very expensive device with you.
Also jopeprogrammer as i said after this regarding playing music through iTunes:
> "Well i never use it for media playing, i used to when i first got it, then started disliking it because the iTunes store kept crashing, and that started my general hatred for iTunes."
As i said, i used it, but then disliked it ~ so i do have a reason to argue my point.

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Long thread. I don't know if it's been mentioned already, but here's my $0.02.

I use iTunes to harvest podcasts and play them. I use some variant of WMP on the desktop or the lappy. Both may make some conversion I might find necessary to interact with my PMP. I use the tools piecemeal to provide me with the content I want where I want.

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Anyone use Audacity here?
It's a fab little program that allows you to change the length of the songs ans stuff.
I often get the problem where the last track on an album has like 1 minute of silence after it, but when i play it on a CD-Player it ignores it. So i find it really useful.

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People that give bad reasons for hating something annoy me, but what annoys me more than that are people who enthusiastically proclaim their love for something without any reasons being given.

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aaaa ok i can arrange my playlists easily i can modify the audio option the equalizer and the sound of the song it self +100% or -100% but i hate it in video cause it gets slower in video :(

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That is the main downfall of iTunes, video playback. Use Quicktime instead if you apple mad, or use WMP for all!
I have Power DVD so that does me for movie watching :)

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That is the main downfall of iTunes, video playback. Use Quicktime instead if you apple mad, or use WMP for all!
I have Power DVD so that does me for movie watching :)

It suffices for music videos. I don't think iTunes was ever intended to be a true movie-player anyway, I mean, it has a movie section under "Library", but that's more to cater to the iPod. A few iTunes updates have made the video playback issue better, but QuickTime is still superior in terms of playback quality.

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QuickTime is inferior to WMP in my opinion. QuickTime seems to play a lot more obscure formats than WMP does but when you install quicktime it autoamtically makes itself the default player for watching video in the page (whereas wmp would usually open up) and its performance is much more jerky than WMP

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