Have you read the Bible?
Despite his rudeness, I am quite sure that the bible does not think individuals should use birth control. "It is God's plan that you should have x amount of children, and using birth control is like insulting god's plan." Or so, that is what I have heard from Christians..
Eh, I've never heard that.
But if anyone has a verse, send it to me so I can take a look at it.
I'm sure it would probably be from the OT, and like I've said before, Christians don't use that as a reference or guide for our lives today. We use the NT for that.
If I remember the verse correctly I think it's something along the lines of: It's better that his seed fall in a whore than on the ground.
Was that in the OT or NT?
Well, there was that verse in the old testament ... not very appropriate to post on a public forum ... if I can find it I'll make reference to it.
I totally missed this post.
Yeah, it would make sense if it was located in the OT.
I think it was in the old testament.. but many Christians still consider it a guide to living life as god intended.. maybe more metaphorically than literally, but still.
Birth control seems to be something that a lot of the different denominations disagree with, so there probably isn't any direct mention of it in the Bible.
I thought no birth control was mostly a catholic thing.
hah.. I guess thats why I thought Christians were against the use of birth control.
I thought no birth control was mostly a catholic thing.
Lol... that's what I thought at first. But then I thought I was wrong.
Been looking at it; without knowing what verse everyone thinks they're discussing, all I can do is follow what leads I have. I haven't exactly read the whole thing through, but the only thing I can come up with so far is Genesis 38, which covers something that might look simular to the casual observer. If any of the others considering the question have a better verse reference, I'd be happy to check that (or those) out as well.
No birth control is a catholic thing, but I think others are no birth control too.
How many religions can we list that are all christian? Babtist, catholic, methodist, lutheran, protestant, mormon, nondenominational (which kind of seems like a denomination in itself), I can't think of any others but I'm sure there are more.
Nitpicking:
1. It's 'baptist', not 'babtist'. Refer to the gospels for John the Baptist on spelling.
2. 'Protestant' is a generic term for all of the variant denominations that came out of the Reformation. The only one it doesn't historically apply to is the Baptists, who are in the faith lineage of the various Anabaptist groups which existed during the time from Emperor Constantine officially established the State Church (Catholicism) and the Reformation. Subsets would include groups such as the Vaudois of the French/Italian Alps. I say historically because most Baptists these days consider themselves to be part of the Protestant group.
3. Mormons aren't Christians. The addition of the Book of Mormon, as an addition to the scriptures, marks the Mormon religion as a 'Christianity +' group, those who believe that you need something other than Christ, and Him alone, to reach Heavan. Plus Joseph Smith's history of occultism before founding the Mormon religion would tend to cause most Christians to look askance at him and his results.
And JoshSCH is probably going to ream me out on this, as no doubt will plenty of others, but I still say that Catholicism is NOT Christianity. It places too much of an emphasis on works, multiplies the requirements for salvation (example: Seven Sacraments...I can't recall all of them, but I do remember baptism [infant], confession, eucharist [probably not the correct name for the sacrament; I believe the eucharist is the actual wafer itself...], marriage, priesthood, and Extreme Injunction [popularly known as 'Last Rites', although I don't think this term is officially recognized].) The Catholic faith claims it is impossible, no matter how good you have been, or how faithfully you have followed the teachings of the church, you cannot know that you will get to Heaven.
For more evidence on why I hold that Catholicism isn't valid Christianity, please see the work Fifty Years in the Church of Rome, written by Charles Chiniquy.
And JoshSCH is probably going to ream me out on this, as no doubt will plenty of others, but I still say that Catholicism is NOT Christianity. It places too much of an emphasis on works, multiplies the requirements for salvation (example: Seven Sacraments...I can't recall all of them, but I do remember baptism [infant], confession, eucharist [probably not the correct name for the sacrament; I believe the eucharist is the actual wafer itself...], marriage, priesthood, and Extreme Injunction [popularly known as 'Last Rites', although I don't think this term is officially recognized].) The Catholic faith claims it is impossible, no matter how good you have been, or how faithfully you have followed the teachings of the church, you cannot know that you will get to Heaven.
I tend to agree with this too.
And JoshSCH is probably going to ream me out on this, as no doubt will plenty of others, but I still say that Catholicism is NOT Christianity. It places too much of an emphasis on works, multiplies the requirements for salvation (example: Seven Sacraments...I can't recall all of them, but I do remember baptism [infant], confession, eucharist [probably not the correct name for the sacrament; I believe the eucharist is the actual wafer itself...], marriage, priesthood, and Extreme Injunction [popularly known as 'Last Rites', although I don't think this term is officially recognized].) The Catholic faith claims it is impossible, no matter how good you have been, or how faithfully you have followed the teachings of the church, you cannot know that you will get to Heaven.
That is absolutely ridiculous.. Saying catholicism isn't christianity is like saying physics isn't science. Once again, Catholics were the first christians. Peter was the first pope. The majority of the population of the ENTIRE world is catholic. Catholics are just a lot more organized than the protestants.. they have standards and a central point of the church. The 7 sacraments are desired, not necessarily required. And the fact that catholics do not know who will enter heaven is based primarily on the Christian idea that only God can judge people. No one truly knows an individual as god does..
Keep in mind, I am backing up the catholic faith only because I am very knowledgeable about their traditions and faith.. You could consider me an unbiased source as I personally think the entire christian faith is idiotic, and simply a brainwashing cult..
I wouldn't say it's a cult.
haha.. I just saw on MSNBC that the Pope was attacked.. or an attempted attack on him anyway..
That is absolutely ridiculous.. Saying catholicism isn't christianity is like saying physics isn't science. Once again, Catholics were the first christians.
The first Christians weren't 'Catholics', they were 'Followers of the Way'. Then, in the city of Antioch, the term 'Christian' was applied to them; at least some of the sources I've seen indicate that the term was meant as a pejorative, but was instead adopted as a badge of honor.
Peter was the first pope.
On the historical evidence, the first Pope was the Roman Emperor Constantine. And from what I've seen, even to this day the reigning pope bears the imperial roman title 'Pontifex Maximus', which I wouldn't expect if the first pope had been a jewish fisherman, especially one put to death by the roman government. Have you any evidence, other than pronouncements from the Catholic dogma, with which to prove your statement?
The majority of the population of the ENTIRE world is catholic.
So?
13Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:
14Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.
(Note for those who dislike parsing Middle English: Strait translates across as narrow, or as affording little space.)
Catholics are just a lot more organized than the protestants.. they have standards and a central point of the church.
Exactly what do you mean by 'standards'? Are you referring to such things as canon law, or to the various proclamations and pronunciations that have been laden down by various church officials?
And what do you mean by 'central point'? Shouldn't the central point of any church be the glorification of the Lord?
The 7 sacraments are desired, not necessarily required.
I'll give you this one, albeit hesitantly. After all, if you claim no one can know whether or not you can get to heaven, then they can't technically be requirements. Still...
And the fact that catholics do not know who will enter heaven is based primarily on the Christian idea that only God can judge people. No one truly knows an individual as god does..
No individual can know his exact fate, nor the exact fate of another, true enough. But we can know that we have eternal life. Go read First John. Or let me know that I need to post the pertinant portion.
Keep in mind, I am backing up the catholic faith only because I am very knowledgeable about their traditions and faith.. You could consider me an unbiased source as I personally think the entire christian faith is idiotic, and simply a brainwashing cult..
I still believe you to be sadly wrong in this, but so noted.
The first Christians weren't 'Catholics', they were 'Followers of the Way'. Then, in the city of Antioch, the term 'Christian' was applied to them; at least some of the sources I've seen indicate that the term was meant as a pejorative, but was instead adopted as a badge of honor.
The first Christians were indeed Catholic. Every single protestant Christian denomination broke away from the Catholic church. The catholic church remained intact for a long period of time, in which every christian was a catholic.
On the historical evidence, the first Pope was the Roman Emperor Constantine. And from what I've seen, even to this day the reigning pope bears the imperial roman title 'Pontifex Maximus', which I wouldn't expect if the first pope had been a jewish fisherman, especially one put to death by the roman government. Have you any evidence, other than pronouncements from the Catholic dogma, with which to prove your statement?
No, I'm pretty sure it says in the bible that jesus blessed his apostles with the holy spirit (there is some special name for this, when the apostles received the holy spirit, but I forget what it is called.), and asked peter to lead his church.. there is something in the bible relating the pope to peter...
I still believe you to be sadly wrong in this, but so noted.
Hmm.. okay. I don't understand why you argue with me. Catholics are Christian. Period. There really is no question about it. Any legit source or religious expert would tell you that catholics are christians. The protestants are just a bit different from the catholics. How does this make the protestants right, and the catholics wrong? You are biased, and arguing from a standpoint of your own faith.. The main point of christianity was that jesus was the son of god. Everyone who believes this is Christian. There are just many different Christian sects just as there are other religious groups.
You are debating fact, and I don't understand why. The catholic church was once the vocal point for the entire christian community.. and is still considered so by most people. You are supposed to make arguments through the use of objective statements and facts. I suggest you do some impartial reading, and open your mind, not just to the possibility that your Christian sect may be wrong, but to the fact that all of christianity may be wrong.
What is it that makes you a Christian? It's just believing in Jesus Christ. And the Catholics do so that should make them Christians.
Exactly. I don't know how this is debatable at all :-/
exactly...
besides, that of thinking it is irrational to think a jewish fisherman was the first pope, and was killed by the roman government is because catholics have been and will always be separate from any government )even rome. That's why the center of catholicism is indepedent from any other country, and independent state called Vatican. I know some might say that why is it located in rome then, but it is because that was the last place where the head of the church was moved.
Besides, just as recently said... catholics are christians simply because we follow Christ, because we beleive in Him. And it was, indeed, the first "division" (if you allow me to call it that way) of christianism, since the first people who beleived in Him, meaning Christ, followed His teachings, and (what makes catholics catholics) they beleived the Virgin Mary had become pregnant of Jesus because it was God's will, and they also beleived in His miracles and in saints.After his first followers is that came some jerks that were not comfortable with catholic "rules" and created their own rules (see Martin Luther for more references... that's the first one that came to mind...)...
The 7 sacraments are not imposed by the catholic church as the only way to save yourself, but theyare the guide to heaven. As someone said before, only God kows if we may enter to heaven, since He is the only one with wisdom enough to decide that... The only sacrament that must be celebrated is baptism, since itcleans the original sin, imposed by God to men through Adam and Eve, for their disobedience.
That's all that comes to mind... anything else?
i agree that there are some people that are just meant to be together...
i.e. me & my girlfriend met when we were both taking the same class @ university... i was starting my career... itwas my third period... it was her last... all her career she kept saying to herself she would sign in for that class the next period, while i didn't sign it in on time when i had to... and casually we signed it at the same period at the same time... by those days, she was having problems with her boyfriend, and she was long ago hinking on dumping him, but she needed the right excuse...
would you tell that's just luck? there was too much to say its just that we casualy crossed in each other's way...
we've been together for 1 year and 5 months and it really seems this is the one... not that i'm proposing anytime soon (i'm 19... a whole lot to study and faily responsibilities)... but when the time is right, i will...
BTW... we are catholic christians and we do use birth control...
Good luck with your relationship :)
Caleb is also 19... but we've been together for 2 years and 3 months now, so marriage is something that we're looking at in around 3 years.
BTW... we are catholic christians and we do use birth control...
Question:
Do Catholics allow premarital sex?
No. I didn't think any Christians did..
Well catholics don't even believe in birth control, technically. And they are very much against premarital sex. I think most christian sects are.
actually, catholics are against premarital sex, as much are every other division or christianity... but i don't think there is any opposition to birth control when it is within a married couple...
there are catholic "sub-divisions", which have different criteria about different subjects, for example charismatics (which do not kneel before any saint, but Jesus), or Opus Dei, which are against birth control, since they (we) are characterized by having lots of children... some Opus Dei families for example have 12 children... and it's not even that they are against birth control, but prefer abstinence as the best method...
Opus Dei is not associated with the Catholic church anymore.. and most Catholics are against birth control b/c why stop God's will? If he wants you to have a child, then who are you to stop him?
NOTE: These are not my views, just the views of the Catholic church.
who told you Opus Dei is not associated to the catholic church? and better yet...what makes you say that?
I always thought Opus Dei was still associated with the catholic church.
We're a friendly, industry-focused community of developers, IT pros, digital marketers, and technology enthusiasts meeting, networking, learning, and sharing knowledge.