Amd 64 Overclocking Questions

Enthusiasts are reporting quite a bit of success generally with overclocking Athlon64 processors lately, unlike the results gained from the earlier ones to be released. But, as with any processor whatsoever, there are no guarantees that the one you buy will overclock well, and there is simply no such thing as a 'safe' overclock. Anyone who tells you different is a fool.

People should only overclock items that they are quite happy to replace if need be. If you rely on it continuing to operate, don't overclock it. Simple as that! Accept that it might blow up before you start, and that it's your own fault if it does, and you've got the right initial attitude. Anything else is self-delusion!

Processors vary in their capability. It's absolutely incorrect to say "All xxxxxx chips overclock well!"

Some production runs generate better chips than others. Within a particular production run, chips harvested from the centers of the wafers generally perform better than chips harvested from the edges of wafers. It's pot luck what you get, and you should really join a good quality overclockers interest group to gain access to shared information about which production runs have proved to be better performers than others.

so even buying a better heat sink and fan, that will run my cpu at normal temp even while overclocking, won't ensure me that I can over clock with out blowing something up?

The FX series have larger 2nd level caches I think, so you'll never be able to be exactly the same, even if the speed is the same. As it stands, the 3400+ is grunty enough to foot it with the FX-51 as stock. Check out the speed as well, all the sources I looked into said the 3400+ was 2.2GHz but my box said 2.4GHz and my pc says it's running at 2.4GHz so you could be in with a grin without the need for any overclocking. If you're still keen.. check out a good overclockers site like http://www.overclockers.co.nz/ or your regional equivalent.
Nothing ensures that a part won't blow when overclocking.
P.S. If you're gonna overclock, get a good mb (I recommend DFI Lanparty UT 250Gb for price and performance) and quality RAM.

so even buying a better heat sink and fan, that will run my cpu at normal temp even while overclocking, won't ensure me that I can over clock with out blowing something up?

Heat's probably the biggest part of it-- so long as you're running cool, you probably won't "blow it up"/burn it up. But, even if you can run it at normal temperatures, you'll still have to find the right mix of FSB, Clock multiplier, and voltage to get things stable.

First, make sure you've got sufficient cooling, then work on getting things stable. At least, that's the way I go, because I'm paranoid about popping chips. I burned up two XP2400s myself, but that was due to inadequate cooling...

1. An aftermarket heatsink/fan will only keep an overclocked processor at normal temp if the individual processor is capable of running cool enough. The heatsink/fan unit does not guarantee the same temps on EVERY processor of a particular type and model.

2. Even if a cooling solution can keep a particular processor at sub-zero temps, there's no guarantee that running it beyond certain frequency levels will result in stable performance. You can minimise the chance of physical failure, but nothing can overcome the physical limitations of any particular chip.

3. Unless your motherboard allows you to 'lock' the PCI and AGP bus frequencies, overclocking will place undue stress on the motherboard's northbridge chip, and introduce the chance of failure to that component. It's not just the processor you need to be mindful of.

Improved cooling helps, of course, but nothing whatsoever guarantees success. Add your aftermarket heatsink/fan, ensure the OCI/AGP buses are 'locked' and then monitor your temps as you increase your overclock slowly, and test thoroughly for stability at each incremental increase. That's the 'safest' approach, and if you also resist the temptation to increase core voltages, you'll probably find that you can squeeze a bit more performance out of your processor with RELATIVE safety.

The FX series have larger 2nd level caches I think, so you'll never be able to be exactly the same, even if the speed is the same. As it stands, the 3400+ is grunty enough to foot it with the FX-51 as stock. Check out the speed as well, all the sources I looked into said the 3400+ was 2.2GHz but my box said 2.4GHz and my pc says it's running at 2.4GHz so you could be in with a grin without the need for any overclocking. If you're still keen.. check out a good overclockers site like http://www.overclockers.co.nz/ or your regional equivalent.
Nothing ensures that a part won't blow when overclocking.
P.S. If you're gonna overclock, get a good mb (I recommend DFI Lanparty UT 250Gb for price and performance) and quality RAM.

Umm I am pretty sure the Fx has the same L2 cache 1MB, newegg has the FX-55 as L1 64K+64K and L2 1Mb same as the 3400+.
Now the LAn Party by DFI with the 250Gb nforce3 chipset is the motherboard that I am more than likely going to buy. and that motherbaord has built in agp,ram,cpu overclock in its bios.

So what your saying is that even over clocking it 100Mhz can risk damaging something.

The risk might be slight, but it's a risk nevertheless. I doubt that you'd have problems with such an overclock, to tell the truth, but NO-ONE can guarantee that, and the question shouldn't really be asked. When you overclock, you need to take responsibility yourself :)

The AthlonFX processor is NOT the same chip, by the way. Overclocking an Athlon64 might give you similar performance to an AthlonFX, if you can boost it enough, but it won't give you an FX!

Here's an A64 overclocking guide, by the way:

http://www.dugu9tweaks.net/guides/a64oc/index.html

Sorry, the level 2 cache level differs depending on the speed of the 3400+.
2.2GHz = 1Mb
2.4GHz = 512Kb

Yes, there are different versions and configurations of each performance rating 'model'.

yeah im buying the 1Mb cache version just cause of the bigger cache

so wait, when u get the amd 64 it does not run at 200Mhz fsb? or whats that about?

I just want to overclock IF the pc is slow, and I doubt i will be disappointed.

Oh yeah, I looking to buy a 6800Gt 256Mb DDR3, 256-Bit what do u guys think of that to keep the amd 64 company?

It will not perform any better than the higher clocked, lower cache size variant. The performance rating number indicates its performance level.

Edit:

Match the motherboard and processor with PC3200 400MHz RAM or better so that you get the full benefit of the Hypertransport and thus the full performance of the processor. You will NOT be disappointed with performance, have no need to overclock for a while yet, and the 6800GT is an excellent card to match it up with.

I have a question might seem reasonable.

If there are two AMd 64 models, but one operates at 2.4 and the other at 2.2 then why is one safe running at 2.4 and the other can be damaged overclocking to 2.4

is it because of the core? one is clawhammer the other beats me.

And yes im buying pc3200 because I believe that is the max socket 754 mobos accept.

also about the card, my 9600Xt has 4 pipelines the Gt has 16 what difference on games will i see? and it has 64-bit shading and texture filling what exaclty is that? is it designed to work better with the amd 64?

There will be slight changes made to the core, which mean that higher/lower clockspeeds can be used, and different amounts of cache meory put in place, to achieve the same performance. You'll find that all processor lines use such minor changes from time to time, and always have.

Ill just buy the 1mb cache one, and about 3 months or so if my system is stable, Ill buy like a $70 cooling fan and heat-sink and overclcok the cpu to 2.4 or around there. thanks

so I got the cpu,mobo,and ram picked out.

now i need ino on that video card.

Only card available that's any better at present is either the 6800 Ultra or the Radeon X800XT, and it's rather difficult to get hold of one of those yet. The 6800Gt is the best price/performance dispaly card for gaming currently available.

Some manufacturers might modify the specifications a little, but generally brand makes negligible difference, as almost all of them adhere closely to the reference design, thus perform at an almost identical level.