Must goverment be the center of our existence?

[Aia]

I like to read the signature of my fellow Daniloggers. Some are funny, some are inspiring, some just make me think... what in the world?

It is in the thinking part that I engaged when I read this morning the signature of one of our elderst posters. In Ancient Dragon two part signature it says:
"If the people cannot trust their government to do the job for which it exists - to protect them and to promote their common welfare - all else is lost."
Attributed to: Barack Obama
I don't follow the man Obama; I must assume he really said that. But definitely it has the ring of truth as something that would come out of the mouth of a politician.

"All else is lost?". Really?
Must government be the soul of our lives, that if they loose their perspective, everything else is lost?
When did we lose our perspective? Isn't it OURS, the responsibility to protect ourselves and to promote our own welfare?
Can we not exist outside the "all caring, all protecting hand" of government?
Just thinking aloud!. What an arrogant statement, to which I can only yell in silence: Stay away from my life!

No, I don't have any new utopia form of government in mind. I am just reasoning. Every one has the need of using the toilet in the trans course of the day. Toilets are necessary for comfort and hygiene. But as important as they are, we don't make them the center of our daily life, nor the center of our homes, regardless of how many times we go to it; unless we are SICK.
Pardon my vulgar analogy, if you will.

[Salem]

There's not a lot you can do when the vast majority of un-informed sheep can have their vote swayed with a tax cut here or a scandal there.

If you had to pass an exam to determine whether you were well-informed enough to vote, as opposed to making a random choice on the spot (or whatever your bias or bigotry led you to), then things might improve.

Like in parts of the US, it's whoever thumps the bible the hardest which wins. So much for SOCAS, the loonies are running the asylum.

Mind you, 50 more years of internet could make everyone realise that everyone is just a citizen of earth, and all this nationalistic crap will disappear. Nations are so 19th century, the whole idea just isn't up to solving some of the 21st century issues.

[jwenting]

Government should be as small and insignificant as possible, basically providing physical security and emergency services and little else.

[Aia]

>Mind you, 50 more years of internet could make everyone realize that everyone is just a citizen of earth, and all this nationalistic crap will disappear.

Minding I am,
It is attributed to Mark Twain the following:
"Traveling is the cure to prejudice"
Which I have the opportunity to experience in a personal level.

The Internet is providing that opportunity of social interaction which until now traveling had the monopoly of.
However, I can not help to wonder if that will continue as government gets its ugly nose into it; imposing regulations, taxes, spying on its users, and implementing all those wonderful, well intended means of controlling, in the name of security and protection to you and yours.

[GrimJack]

So -- what are the limits you see for government's role in the lives of its citizens?
Do you want to keep Social Security? How about Medicare?
What do you see as the relationship between the gov. and the military?
Would you keep OSHA? Would you keep the FDA? how about the USDA?
Who should be responsible for the Interstate system? The Post Office?
Should we allow CARNIVORE? Homeland Security? TSA?
Who should watch over our food supply? Our drug supply? Our water supply? Our air supply (or our Air Supply)?

[Dave Sinkula]

Mind you, 50 more years of internet could make everyone realise that everyone is just a citizen of earth, and all this nationalistic crap will disappear. Nations are so 19th century, the whole idea just isn't up to solving some of the 21st century issues.

Not quite a federalist, then?

[Dave Sinkula]

So -- what are the limits you see for government's role in the lives of its citizens? Do you want to keep Social Security? How about Medicare? What do you see as the relationship between the gov. and the military? Would you keep OSHA? Would you keep the FDA? how about the USDA? Who should be responsible for the Interstate system? The Post Office? Should we allow CARNIVORE? Homeland Security? TSA? Who should watch over our food supply? Our drug supply? Our water supply? Our air supply (or our Air Supply)?

A Rothbardian approach , not all of which I agree with. Whether 'tis 'not most' is TBD. I haven't finished it yet.

[jwenting]

Medicare is a disaster, OSHA is meddling with the rights of people, postal services are far more effecient and cheaper when run as private enterprises.
The drug supply is pretty much guaranteed by the Colombian cartels, the food supply by farmers. Air is as yet free, but I'm certain someone in government is planning to tax it.
DHS and TSA are some of the best examples of why increasing government power is a bad thing.
The government, like the military, should serve the people. Yet in reality it's usually the other way around.

[Aia]

So -- what are the limits you see for government's role in the lives of its citizens? Do you want to keep Social Security? How about Medicare? What do you see as the relationship between the gov. and the military? Would you keep OSHA? Would you keep the FDA? how about the USDA? Who should be responsible for the Interstate system? The Post Office? Should we allow CARNIVORE? Homeland Security? TSA? Who should watch over our food supply? Our drug supply? Our water supply? Our air supply (or our Air Supply)?

You forgot some more acronyms:
Why don't you ask some more questions with these?: FBI the messengers of the ODJ
CIA
NCS
M16 or SIS
KGB
GESTAPO
SS or Schutzstaffel

I am sure that thousand more acronyms for the same services could be found in every nation where its citizen require government to take care of them.

[Aia]

>Air is as yet free, but I'm certain someone in government is planning to tax it.
You betcha! Kyoto Protocol
Commonly known by the buzz word, "Global Warming"

[jwenting]

yup. Of course they're not taxing the air we breathe, but are taxing the CO2 we exhale...

To meet Kyoto standards though is cheap. All we need to do is kill all enviroweenies. The CO2 emissions and hot air those idiots put out is enough to tip the scales :)

[GrimJack]

You forgot some more acronyms: Why don't you ask some more questions with these?: FBI the messengers of the ODJ CIA NCS M16 or SIS KGB GESTAPO SS or Schutzstaffel

I am sure that thousand more acronyms for the same services could be found in every nation where its citizen require government to take care of them.

Do you have a point? This is your response to my questions?

I am asking what limitsyou place on the role of government - I did not ask if you knew more acronyms that me. You started the thread and I am following up with a request for information. I could have asked are you an anarchist (which kind)? or are you propertarian? or are you a libertarian? but those are just labels and most people pick and choose rather than follow definitions down the line.

If you are not interested in and exchange of information, fine.

[Dave Sinkula]

So -- what are the limits you see for government's role in the lives of its citizens? Do you want to keep Social Security? How about Medicare? What do you see as the relationship between the gov. and the military? Would you keep OSHA? Would you keep the FDA? how about the USDA? Who should be responsible for the Interstate system? The Post Office? Should we allow CARNIVORE? Homeland Security? TSA? Who should watch over our food supply? Our drug supply? Our water supply? Our air supply (or our Air Supply)?

Not to intrude, but...I cannot undertake to lay my finger on that article of the Constitution which granted a right to Congress of expending, on the objects of benevolence, the money of their constituents.
-- James Madison

[Paul Thompson]

Government is a great, great thing. As much as it it annoying i think without it helping and 'being the centre of out existance' we all would be in a much worse place today. Governments are sort of like a buisness that has a monopoly on a whole place and can do with it whatever it pleases.
But even though they have a monopoly they dont do all bad. I think one thing that does happen is the news highlights the bad rather then focusing on what Good has happend so in some cases people will think what the media want them to think. The government being the center of out existance it important because even though we sometimes hate it to bits what would we do without it? Who would fix the roads? Who would keep public transport running? What about all the schools. I think that we Need a center of our existance to do those jobs so we dont have to. Sorry if you dont agree thats just my personal opinion

[hughv]

Maybe the question needs some re-phrasing?
"What should the role of government be."
I think the constitution is pretty specific:
"We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America."
There's a lot more detail, of course, but governments do have a useful and necessary function.
The current problems stem largely from an indifferent, uneducated electorate, a supine, venal congress and an incompetent president surrounded by advisers who are completely out of touch with us common folk.
Anarchy sucks, but we do have a history of revolution, and maybe it's time that the people take back the power.
I agree that the internet can help, but education would help even more.

[Ancient Dragon]

Must goverment be the center of our existence?
Yes, it is. Without government there would be just chaos. Government, from the tiny village to the federal government affects our every day lives. I can't think of a thing I do (yes, even in the privacy of my bedroom and bathroom) that isn't affected by some goverment in some way.

[Ancient Dragon]

It is in the thinking part that I engaged when I read this morning the signature of one of our elderst posters. In Ancient Dragon two part signature it says:

Wrong link. :)

[Aia]

Wrong link. :)

My apologies for the link, I am baffled by the mystery of how I got the wrong link, even when I previewed it for successful result before I posted.
Thankfully, most people knows who you are and have seen you around. ;)

[jwenting]

Must goverment be the center of our existence? Yes, it is. Without government there would be just chaos. Government, from the tiny village to the federal government affects our every day lives. I can't think of a thing I do (yes, even in the privacy of my bedroom and bathroom) that isn't affected by some goverment in some way.

That doesn't answer the question...
You have just proven that the government IS the center of our existence. But you've not stated whether it should be...

[Ancient Dragon]

That doesn't answer the question... You have just proven that the government IS the center of our existence. But you've not stated whether it should be...

I can't imagine life without the interference of government. It isn't really thecenter of my life, only is a large part. The only way government could not be such as huge part is if I lived on some remote island all by myself with no outside influence.

As for should it be? Yes. We need someone to do those things and provide those services that we can not do ourselves.