What is 6+2x10 ? - Page 4

[VernonDozier]

OK, I'm done with this thread. This getting ridiculous. Skilly, you're one of a handful of things, I'm not sure which one.

1) Too proud to simply admit that you're wrong.
2) Someone who simply can't get it no matter how many times it's explained.
3) A troll who's just trying to lure me into a flame war.

The fact that, assuming I'm reading my Control Panel correctly, you JUST NOW down-voted a post of mine in this thread from four frigging months ago suggests troll. You also appear to have randomly down-voted a whole bunch of people in some other thread, also suggesting either a troll or a spiteful, immature person.

Against my better judgment, I'm going to give it one more shot. I know I'm going to regret it.

One, it's doubtful you're going to find an algebra equation in a math book where you solve for x and it looks like this. Normally x is on the right. IF it isn't, you change it so it is.

6+2x10=26

You change it to this.

6+20x=26

Then this.

20x=20

Then you divide by 20, so x is 1, not 0.3. Where did 0.3 come from?

You're right, x is USUALLY (though not always) a variable in algebra. That's why you use a dot for multiplication in algebra instead of x when multiplying. Another one of those rules made before any of us were born. Perhaps "convention" is a better word than "rule" here.

This is all irrelevant though, because it's extremely obvious that in THIS thread, x is used as the multiplication symbol. It's not a variable, so why even bring that up?

if i remember correctly, x is always a variable algebra. you need parentheses to multiply.

You remember incorrectly. You don't need any parentheses to multiply. If you always needed parentheses, no one would have bothered inventing the acronym PEMDAS in the first place. The acronym would be "P" for parentheses.

In sum, whether you're doing arithmetic or writing code, you multiply before you add and if you have two consecutive multiplication or division operations, you go left to right if there are no parentheses. It's completely irrelevant whether these rules make sense to you. There's ONE and only ONE answer to 15 / 3 * 5 and it ain't 1 and it ain't "none of the above" when you change the '*' to an 'x'. They're the rules, period, unless you want to be Humpty Dumpty and don't care whether anyone understands you...

'When I use a word,' Humpty Dumpty said, in rather a scornful tone, 'it means just what I choose it to mean — neither more nor less.'

'The question is,' said Alice, 'whether you can make words mean so many different things.'

'The question is,' said Humpty Dumpty, 'which is to be master — that's all.'

[skilly]

when solving for x, the equation:
6+2x10=
2x10=-6 //subtract 6 from each side
20x=-6 //simplify
x=-6/20 //divide 20 from each side
x=-3/10 //lowest common denominator
x=-0.3 //decimal conversion

you can write it different ways depending what steps you want show.
we done azmah?

[VernonDozier]

when solving for x, the equation:
6+2x10=

That isn't an equation. If it was an equation that you were solving for x, you'd have something on both sides of the equals sign. THIS is an equation.

6+2x10= 0

In which case you'd be right if you were solving for x. But again, it's completely irrelevant for this thread. 'x' means multiply in this thread. We're not solving for x.

[skilly]

and there is no equal sign, also,

the comments on the upvotes i gave you in this thread haven't been showing up, either, so also i agree repetition/drilling is best.

-edit i know 15/3*5, could also be written 5(15/3),just pointing out how the "/" char can lead to confusion when unlearning to relearn

[cwarn23]

Since how this is a computer geek forum and computers can easily solve math then what about algebra. I shall post an algebra equation and see how you's can solve that XD

a=something
b=something
print (((((pow(a,pow(3,b))*b)|(a*a))>>100000)+pow(a,b))/2)

I have the answer so what does A equal and B equal if the answer of the formula is 12464273528384 . I'm sure you all learn't this at school and collage. :)

[skilly]

related functions for C are exp(), log(), and sqrt().
but i am rusty at C especially pow().
it is easier on paper as algebra first.
and i am lazy, time to remove my eyeballs!

[skilly]

*strange notes*
punch 6,+,2,*,10,= into windows7 calc and you get 80
punch 15,/,3,*,5,= and you get 25

[TrustyTony]

So it got only second one right only because of straight left to right priority, switch to scientific mode and I think it even manage the subject of the thread.

[NetJunkie]

Well if you are a kid in 3rd grade, if even that long, you would probably say 80 but as we "all" learn is there is something called Order of Operations making the answer 26. No offense, but there was not much thinking involved at all ;)

[NetJunkie]

Then you divide by 20, so x is 1, not 0.3. Where did 0.3 come from?

I am guessing he is settings the problem to 0 which makes the new equation this:

6+2x10=0

Then you would subtract 6 from both sides which in turn makes the new equation this:

2x10=-6

Now, you would take the 2x and multipy by 10 and you would get 20x. Now the equation is:

20x=-6

Then, to solve for x, you would divide both sides by 20 and get:

x=-0.3

So in reality, the answer was "right" but the sign that was submitted was incorrect.

[cwarn23]

Since how this is a computer geek forum and computers can easily solve math then what about algebra. I shall post an algebra equation and see how you's can solve that XD

a=something
b=something
print (((((pow(a,pow(3,b))*b)|(a*a))>>100000)+pow(a,b))/2)

I have the answer so what does A equal and B equal if the answer of the formula is 12464273528384 . I'm sure you all learn't this at school and collage. :)

Still no answers to my equation?
G' Computer Gurus are so reliant on computers solving math problems for them and when it comes to algebra then they don't have a hope at all.

[Azmah]

Yes it was that, but now it's formatting is screwed.

??? Are you talking about the link I posted in this post? It works for me, I just tried it again.

[Azmah]

What do you mean?

I am very skeptic of mathematics by rules for simple maths. For me it is better to understand the meaning and do things by mind to avoid mistakes. For example my short version of "percent maths" rules: 100% = 1.00 = 100/100 and mark unknown with x. In my opinion there is no percent maths only numbers and maths.

[Azmah]

Where in the world has this come from?

(C)romfachau = Parentheses
(O) = Of/Order
(R)hannu = Divide
(L)luosi = Multiply
(A)dio = Add
(T)ynnu = Subtract

Just the same old same old.

[Azmah]

That's fine, we're here to learn together. Thanks for being open.

using BODMAS we get 6+(2x10) = 26 previously i thought 6+2x10= 80

[Azmah]

Quite a few languages are like that. Javascript is the only one I can currently think of.

That's funny. My compiler seems to think differently.

#include <iostream>
using namespace std;

int main()
{
    int a = 15 / 3 * 5;
    int b = 15 / 5 * 3;
    cout << a << '\t' << b;
    return 0;
}

So did all of my math professors. So do these five hundred thousand links.

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=algebra+left+to+right+precedence

[Azmah]

You learn base 2 in year 2?!

I've seen #x used as a base indicator, so the problem could be "what is 6 plus (10 in base 2)". And I've never heard of PODMAS, or whatever. We learned it the hard way, in the snow, uphill both ways! And in the 2nd grade.

[Azmah]

Where did you learn that it would equal 80? No, you won't be marked on a curve - especially not the bell curve ... which is one of the most improperly and inaccurate forms of statistics.

Think? Thinking is good!(ha) The way I was taught, the result would be 80. Now if you used brackets; (2 X 10) , then the answer would be 26. Am I missing something , not thinking enough? (man I cant afford lower points as a member! Joined way back but just lost track of this site, moved, etc. Are you grading this one on a curve!?? ha)
....( what I'd like to know, is why did I not see the umpteen million posts to this question already? instead of 0 posts? )

[Azmah]

What do you mean 2 time X time 10?

You had bad teacher then. Use your brain is best teaching. By the way writing in 2 x 10 makes difference for me, for some reason. It does not look like 2 times X times 10 any more. Interesting.. But maybe it is about time to close this thread.

[Azmah]

Yes please

And... can anyone give me a clue what that last reply said? "2 time X times 10" ????
Also... it would be helpful to include one's own solution, and explain the error in what
used to be accepted math.

[Azmah]

What a very good analogy, Ancient Dragon

It was never excepted math, at least not since the stone ages. One way to think of the problem is like this: You bought 2 widgets for $10.00 each, plus it will cost you $6.00 shipping/handling for both of them. I hope you won't pay $80.00 for that :S If you will, then I have more widgets I'll sell you.

[Azmah]

Right! Now I get what you mean ^_^ Though why would you think --> x <-- being a pronumeral variable instead of a symbol for multiplying the figures? Should I then have put --> * <-- ?

Ok my purposeful misinterpretation of question is:

1) in maths multiplication is left out between variable and number
2) X is generally denoted as unknown factor

Therefor 2X10 is 2 times X times 10 == 20X

and of course result is correctly 26, in my interpretation it is 20x+6 simplified.

[Azmah]

What?

:icon_evil:purposeful misinterpretation

[Azmah]

This relates to pyTony's query about what the equation/question meant :)

@vernondozier 15/3*5=25or1 (or anyone else)

so how can we explain the difference of these two/three verbally?:

"fifteen over three times five equals 1"
"fifteen divided by three times five equals 25"
"15
---- =1
3(5)"
"15/3*5=25"
i guess we are all just playing with words, but saving bits is kinda important right? hmmm...i see it best as "fifteen over three times five" because of the misleading forward-slash. guess i need to study some more different types of programming :)

[Azmah]

You make an excellent point

There's nothing misleading about any of it. At some point before any of us were born someone made a bunch of rules for operator precedence in algebra and anyone who wants to be able to communicate effectively follows them. Whether it's PEMDAS, BOMDAS, or any other acronym, the rules are the same worldwide. The people who write computer programming languages make their languages follow the algebra rules that already exist, add a few more, then establish an order of precedence for operators and publish it, and those are the rules that everyone follows if they want to use the language. Why do we end statements in C++ with semicolons instead of with dollar signs? Somebody made a rule that made sense to him and everyone now follows it if they want to write code in C++. Otherwise no one could ever communicate with anyone else and no program would ever compile and run correctly because the guy who wrote the compiler and the guy who wrote the program can't agree on what 15 / 3 * 5 is. It's the same reason everyone drives on the same side of the road. It really doesn't matter which side it is just as long as everyone agrees. The American who moves to England and insists on continuing to drive on the right side of the road is going to have problems.

How do you explain it verbally? It's difficult. I guess you make really long pauses or mime parentheses where they're supposed to be till the other person gets it. It's better to write it.

[skilly]

ok, azmah, but you did type 'x' as a variable. i just wanted to point out that it looks more like the letter 'x' than a multiply symbol :) heh hee,

[Azmah]

ok, azmah, but you did type 'x' as a variable. i just wanted to point out that it looks more like the letter 'x' than a multiply symbol :) heh hee,

Hahah ... I must say - VERY GOOD one. COmpletley original to this post ;D Congrats.

Have you worked it out :P ?

[brenice]

the answer is of course 26 please do not forget to apply MDAS rule

SNIP SNIP SNIP

[cuteShama]

According to DMAS rule its 26.
thanks

[Azmah]

MDAS and DMAS. So now we can happily interchange between division first, then multiplication first? I don't think so.
What's your say?