Member Avatar for rotten69

Hi everyone,

I consider myself as a java beginner because I haven't been involved in a lot of projects. I'm opening this thread to raise awareness that we don't have java projects thread primarily for beginners and it could help advanced java programmers in terms of practising their java knowledge. I would like any operators in this forum to consider this idea. I am sure it will help people who haven't practisied what they have learnt. Any users likes the sound of the idea and wants to see it in this forum, please have your say here. Therefore, operators can know that there are some people interested in the idea.

I had a look at the python forum and they have got something to help python beginners increase their knowledge and get their hands on practical projects. I had a thought of going back to learning python but then I thought it is worth sticking to the languages I know because I want to use them. And, If I had to learn python again, that shouldn't be a major issue.

Thanks for reading this and please do have your opinion on the idea. I would really love to hear from you people.

Edited by peter_budo because: Closing thread
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Stuugie commented: Great Idea +2
JamesCherrill commented: Excellent idea, I will implement it. +14
Member Avatar for Stuugie

I think it is a great idea. I've seen this sort of idea on other forums but I also saw the gurus duking it out over what beginners do wrong and gurus are always right and yada-yada-yada! Most of all you that I have encountered here do not come across as coding gods so there should be no issues in that regard.

A Projects for Beginners would also be a good resource for students to try and get help with their own school projects. I wish I knew about this site while I was taking a course called Data Structures & Algorithms with Java. I had/have no problem with the concepts from the course which covered areas like deques, queues, stacks, trees, linked lists, mapping, and more but the coding part, especially at exam time always put me through the ringers.

Now that I've winded myself, I fully agree with this idea and good one for bringing it up.

Member Avatar for rotten69

Thanks for passing by and agreeing with the idea. Speaking of algorithms and data structures course in java, I thought about taking this course.Although, I wasn't entirely sure about the concepts and things like that. I heard they're all based on maths and you need to have a strong background in maths to solve many problems. I think I can read a book on this topic and try teaching myself the concepts.

The question I had in mind though is Should I get better at programming in java before taking that course or should I just learn the data structures and algorithms first and that will help me understand how to achieve a lot of things? Furthermore, I had a look at a book on the topic and it seems to be quite easy to understand how things work such as loops, for-loops, if-statements and making a good method with solid algorithms in mind.

I would love to see a sticky thread made by an operator or someone who has got very good and in-depth knowledge of Java and can start making small useful projects and get the discussion going. There is a thread in this forum but it is more about resources and FAQs.

Member Avatar for Stuugie

Hey rotten69, I wouldn't say that math is a huge part of the topics that I mentioned but I found some of the concepts to be tricky to think through line by line. Most of my coding background thus far comes in the form of programming Excel books via VBA, VB.NET, SQL, Java, and C# with the brunt of my limited knowledge in Excel coding. With VBA, I have no problems putting thoughts into code, line by line. However with Java and C#, I have a harder time doing that. Linked Nodes have been my crutch with regards to linked lists and trees as I have a hard time mentally processing how each node via code points to the next node and it's element. I got hung up on this in class and wound up failing it because of when nodes became doubly linked nodes. Since I didn't get that, doubly linked lists, trees, and mapping were never truly understood. I've had classmates tell me not to worry about how or why the code does what it does with regards to nodes but to just memorize the data structures. I don't learn by memorizing, I learn by understanding and I'm still foggy headed if I think about data structures and algorithms.

In saying all that, if you get how nodes and doubly linked nodes work, the structures and algorithms won't be that tough for you to learn. I for one know that if I need to code a tree structure I'll use the built in classes. Unless of course the fog lifts one day for me. Hopefully you are right about this project thread and someone with the power to stick it does.

commented: thanks for the reply +4
Member Avatar for rotten69

Oh yeah, I see what you're coming from. When I started learning Java at uni, the codes that my lecturer was going through were just in plain English. For example, if x is instance of y; do something. Right. This looks simple. But, If you want to understand other things like simple-looking tricky loops, here is where you will need to spend some time breaking down the loop and following every variable/variant used in the loop and giving it a value as the loop does increment or decrement. And also, things like Array and ArrayList and lots of stuff like that.

Member Avatar for JamesCherrill

It seems to me that the great majority of the people starting threads here are beginners/early stage learners anyway, so if there were a new forum as you suggest, what guidelines would you give people to tell them which forum to post in?

Member Avatar for Stuugie

Hi JamesCherrill, If I understand rotten's suggest right, it wouldn't necessarily be a thread for newbies to post questions unless they are asking about a particular project presented by a guru here.

Member Avatar for JamesCherrill

OK, I'll pass this idea on to the Moderators/Admins team and see how everyone there feels about making a new sticky Thread for project suggestions, then I'll report back here with any responses.

Member Avatar for slim.helu.92

It is a great idea for both beginners and advanced programmers. Thanx rotten69!

Member Avatar for rotten69

Hi James, I'm strongly and kindly suggesting for Java operators to open a sticky thread for beginner to intermediate projects. Just allowing learners who just start learning Java, to have a look and feel of what they can do by programming in java.

Guidelines are pretty simple. An operator, of course will expectedly post more than one project over the time and a walk-through as well to explain how things can be solved for a particular project. The guidelines that I can suggest at the moment are as follows:

  • Numbering the project so this can help users if they want to ask/refer to a particular project.
  • Anything off topic can not be posted.
  • Active discussion between users that what we'd like to see. Also Get the java community on this website active.

Have a look at the website I posted up in my first article. That should give you an idea of what should be done in the java forum.

Member Avatar for ~s.o.s~

I have replied to James in the mod section and I'll reply here again. I'm favour of a new sticky thread as long as it stays on-topic and doesn't become a dumping ground for "plz halp me" posts. Someone will also need to ensure that "reponses" to the challenges/projects are not posted in the same thread so as to clutter it. It's a difficult task (e.g. take a look at the number of deleted posts in the current Java forum sticky) but if the Java forum members can pull it off, it would be a nice addition to the forum. That being said, I approve of the idea and would be more than happy if James lead the initiative.

Edited by ~s.o.s~
commented: Thank you for liking the idea. Yeah, it needs some serious action and someone keeps an eye on what is posted. +0
Member Avatar for rotten69

Maybe as a guide for those are posting for help with their Java problems, they will be given a -1 rep. Or that is a bit harsh?

Yeah, we would like to see people post something related to any of the numbered projects in the thread if they have any questions. But, the concern here is that what if a project X is a few months/years old and someone started going through the projects and wanted to ask about that particular project.

Someone will also need to ensure that "reponses" to the challenges/projects are not posted in the same thread

Where would people ask about a challange/project that is posted in the thread? Would they have to open a new thread for example?

Cheers,

Edited by rotten69
Member Avatar for Ezzaral

Where would people ask about a challange/project that is posted in the thread? Would they have to open a new thread for example?

Yes, they would need to start their own thread. If questions about the projects were allowed in the sticky thread, it would very quickly grow to an enormous mess.

Member Avatar for rotten69

Alright. I see what you mean. Thanks Ezzaral. I hope you guys are looking into the idea and it will be worked on soon. I just look forward to it.

Cheers,

Member Avatar for rotten69

How are our moderators going with the idea? Is it still on and will be up in the forum hopefully?

Member Avatar for JamesCherrill

It's being actively discussed - there aren't a lot of sticky threads, so it's not going to be a rushed decision. As long as people continue to express new views people will listen.

Member Avatar for rotten69

So do we give it a few days then ?

Member Avatar for JamesCherrill

Like I said - let's see what opinions everyone has. This is peak holiday season, so we should allow a couple of weeks for people who happen to be away this week. We're talking about maybe building a resource that will be used for years, so let's take a bit of time to get it right.

Member Avatar for rotten69

Ah, interesting. It is not a holiday season over here in Australia. I think making the decision for this request is going to be useful and helpful in the long run rather than the short run.

Member Avatar for rotten69

Any of you guys will be interested in the idea discussed above? Show us the number of people liking the idea by posting your opinions here so mods can quickly decide whether to open a new thread for projects or not. I really hope that doesn't stop them from opening a thread for people who are willing to come to Daniweb to practise their knowledge of Java.

Cheers,

Member Avatar for NormR1

What would be posted in this new thread and who would post it?
How would it keep on track? Who would decide if a post is relevant?

Member Avatar for Stuugie

I'm sure that if there were volunteers needed to moderate this thread, you'll find them. Perhaps rotten would spare time to make sure the thread stays on track.

Member Avatar for rotten69

@ Stuugie... I will definitely check the thread a couple of times a day and see what the project problems are. I would try solving them myself. I don't think I will be able to post a project problem and let others follow it because I don't consider myself as an advanced Java programmer. I can still throw some ideas in the thread or somewhere in the forum.

@ NormR1... I'm also sure that you can find some mods who are more than happy to post project problems like what is in the python forum/thread and explain them and let others follow them easily. The person who is responsibile for the thread, is deciding on what is relevent or not. There will be some rules in the new thread to let people know that if they are posting something irrelevent, then they'll get a pently of a minus rep or something similar. They should keep their posts on one of the topics discussed in the thread if they're posting in the thread. Or the other option is that they can post questions about any project problems in a new thread so that way the project thread won't be too busy and crowded.

Member Avatar for Stuugie

@rotten69, I think some of the issues pointed out are about moderating the projects thread to make sure that no one is posting regular questions ie: Help me with loops. I'm sure that the existing moderators and admin have their hands full with keeping this site running smoothly and they may not want the extra work involved with this type of sticky. Hence, others would have to step up to make sure that the Projects for Beginners sticky is moderated (by non-moderators).

Member Avatar for JamesCherrill

Hi all
I'm perfectly happy to set up a thread for project suggestions, and establish some guidelines to help keep it focussed. I've started a discussion in the moderator's forum to get suggestions there as well. There have been no objections to it, so I will soon start it up and we'll see how it goes. If we get some good input then I'll make it a sticky. Any DaniWeb moderator has the ability to moderate any thread, so it won't be a one-man show, nor will it depend on any one mod being available to keep it clean.
J

commented: Glad to hear that there are some positive thought on this matter. +4
Member Avatar for ~s.o.s~

Also mods rely on the "flag bad post" reports by regulars to keep the forum clean so as long as any "regular" flags off-topic posts, it would be a big help and should make the life of moderators easier.

Also, to kickstart the thread, it will be a good idea to "mimic" the one in the Python forum and let the regulars decide the direction which the thread should take.

Edited by ~s.o.s~
commented: I agree with you on that! +4
Member Avatar for rotten69

I agree with s.o.s on that idea. A couple of examples I can think of right now are 1- Making a calculator in java, 2- Making something similar to a phone contact book, 3- Perhaps, making a simple game that doesn't require an advanced level of programming.

I guess the main reason that I've suggested the idea for is I had a look at the python forum and saw an active thread with a number of projects. Man, I did python when I started my uni degree but I honestly didn't give it so much credit like I did for Java. I thought python isn't widely used and so on. I got told that it is used by Google which made me a little surprised at that time. I had so many questions like how Google uses it, what Google uses it for and so on! The reason being that python was technically my second programming language. However, at that time I had no idea what you can do by using a programming language. Programming was just over my head when it was talked about or discussed in some uni lectures. So seeing the forum with the projects discussed in it shows me you can do a lot of things just using a simple programming language that is python. That actually made me want to go back to learning it because it isn't hard.

I wanted a similar thread for Java programmers as well. I believe there are some people struggling to understand it or they have understood the basics but they don't know where to go from there. Because there aren't many small walk-through projects online.

Edited by rotten69
Member Avatar for shashikumar s g

hi,i have a idea how write the java program and how the java concepts work but i want to start the developing the applications with the java but i dont know how and which tools need to use to develop...

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