Ram upgrade problems/nightmares

[cj51]

Hi,
story so far: I have a 6340 ver:1 motherboard (it says so on my Motherboard) with two 128 MB sticks of RAM. I recently got a 512MB stick - its rated 64M x 64 - I used the Crucial.com scan to tell me what memory to use (shown below). The crucial scan showed my m/b as being 6340M, but I assume they are the same.

Crucial CT64M64S4D7E 512MB:
SDRAM, PC133 • CL=2 • Unbuffered • Non-parity • 133MHz • 3.3V • 64Meg x 64

I can't get the sytem to respond with the new 512 MB stick in it.
My m/b details are shown here:
http://www.msi.com.tw/program/products/mainboard/mbd/pro_mbd_detail.php?UID=131
This states, "Supports a maximum memory size of 1GB (32M x 8)."

QUESTION 1: I take it this means the 64M x 64 512MB stick that Crucial recommended does not work on my system?

QUESTION 2: I think I get the 32M x 8 concept. For a double sided (DS) stick, this means 32M x 8 x 2 = 512 MB. OK.
What I dont get is the Crucial stick with what I assume is essentially 64M x 8 (I assume 8, since 8 chips on each side). Its DS, therefore 64M x 8 x 2 = 1024 MB. The Crucial is a 512 MB stick, so can someone please tell me what is wrong with my 'logic' here?

Phew! I've resisted all urges to swear so far. Replies appreciated.

[Catweazle]

According to the specifications on their website, CT64M64S4D7E is not non-parity, it's ECC

http://www.crucial.com/store/listModule.asp?module=SDRAM%2C+PC133&cat=RAM&package=allModules

CT64M64S4D75 is the non-parity module

[cj51]

Not that I want to pick a fight CatWeazle, but both are non-parity with regards to error checking. Maybe you meant something else. Apologies if I am wrong.

The only difference I can find between the two is the cl memory timing. I never though this made a difference in terms of whether they would work on my system or not?

I'm confused................!

[cj51]

another question: does the fact that I am restricted to having memory of 32M x 8 by the Motherboard mean that I can only use up to 256 MB Ram sticks on my system such as stick below:?

CT32M64S4D7E SDRAM, PC133 • CL=2 • Unbuffered • Non-parity • 133MHz • 3.3V • 32Meg x 64

I still don't understand what the 64 signifies.

Responses appreciated. If I ever become a millionaire, I will give all repliers £2 grand! LOL. In fact, better make that a billionaire - just to be sure. ;)

[Catweazle]

ooops....

Apologies for the earlier error. Now I'm convinced that stopping work and getting some sleep at 3 am was a good idea :)

The 64M x 64, the 32M x 64 and the 32M x 8 refer to capcities.

Memory chips and memory modules are organised as matrices of cells. The figures represent width and depth of that matrix, and their product represents overall capacity. But they're measured in mega[/]bits[/i]. not megabytes. Calculate the product of the figure, then divide by 8 to get capacity in megabytes.

It gets a bit complicated, because the capacity needs to be considered in light of other factors to determine what type of memory module it is. Memory modules are organised in different way - a single memory chip may contain more than one units of capacity, a 'double sided' module of RAM may have all the chips physically located on the one side!

Suffice to say that, for a 64M x 64 module, the unit of capacity is 64 megabits, there are 64 such units present, thus the module has 4096 megabits, or 512 megabytes, capacity.

If your motherboard is restriced to 32M chips, then that module is not suitable for use in it.

My main concern is the quality of RAM sold by Crucial. they don't actually make it. They commission the stuff from manufacturers of generic, unbranded RAM then rebadge and sell it. I've seen examples of quite a few people getting shoddy product.

If you've used their online calculator, purchased the RAM from them as a result, and it doesn't work, then I'd do the following:

* Reset CMOS, and try again to boot the system. It may be recognised correctly after the contents of CMOS have been cleared.
* If it still doesn't work, contact Crucial and see if you can return it for refund.

I'm not sure if they will allow you to return it. I've looked at the warranty terms on their website, and while they guarantee that the modules are in working order, and will replace them if they are faulty, they do NOT seem to guarantee that their online calculator is accurate.

[cj51]

Thanks so much for the reply Catweazle.

I am now enlightened with regards to memory!

I actually used the Crucial system scan to get the memory part no., and bought it 2nd hand on Ebay. (Apologies to you [Catweazle] for taking the time to find out if Crucial would give refund.)

I'm shocked that Crucial simply rebrand memory. Shame on them I say.

Re. resetting CMOS - I'm a bit wary of doing that! I might give it a try - I'll have to read up on resetting CMOS 1st. If it don't work I guess I'll just resell on Ebay (I don't think that I would have damaged the memory).

Once again Catweazle, thank-you. :D

[Coconut Monkey]

I'm shocked that Crucial simply rebrand memory.

I wouldn't be! Many high-profile memory producers do the same. You will find a lot of memory chips come from either Samsung, Hyundai/Hynix, Winbond and a collection of lesser known "generic" manufacturers.

[Catweazle]

We recommend sticking to a small number of very reputable brands for RAM modules:

Corsair
Geil
Kingston
Kingmax
OCZ

would be the core group to pick from.

[cj51]

As a final note:

I took out "old/working" ram and put in the "new" ram, unplugged the power cable, and reset the bios using the jumper as the motherboard manual stated. I then replugged power supply and tryed to boot. Nada.

Looks like I learned the hard way that its always better to read the relevant section of the mobo manual before buying hardware. Ooh well, at least I've learned something!

Thanks guys for the replies. Appreciated.

Just out of curiousity, whenever I checked the bios settings afterwards, the only value that had changed was "clear NVRAM" from "No" to "Yes". So I changed it back to "No". Does anyone know if this is the actual bios memory ram, or am I off on a tangent again?

[chawk02]

Regarding Crucial not making the memory they sell:

Crucial is a direct division of Micron, who is one of the largest makers of memory in the world. Crucial does not "rebrand" anyone else's components to make the modules they sell.

Once in a while, Crucial will offer a solution that has been made by another manufacture, ie. Samsung, Infineon if they do not have a solution available from Micron.

As far as the module not working, if purchased from eBay it might have been a dead module anyway. Crucial does have a limited lifetime warranty and I'm sure they will be able to exchange the module for another one that has been tested good.

Crucial is one of the TOP TIER memory providers in the world, so it amazes me how some can flame without knowing any facts! :confused:

If the system you have is an OEM or whitebox, the motherboard may have been a 6340, but whomever OEM'd it for their purpose can change the BIOS to fit their needs. Or like I said earlier... purchased from eBay, might just be a dead module.

Contact Crucial and see if they will exchange the part for you. If you have issues, Crucial Tech Support will be able to assist as well.

Good luck in your endeavors.

[DoctorDread]

We recommend sticking to a small number of very reputable brands for RAM modules:

Corsair
Geil
Kingston
Kingmax
OCZ

would be the core group to pick from.

Reputation is only as good as the person's experience with that company.

Hmm, the last thing I heard Corsair, Geil and Kingston do not even make their own memory components.

Interesting....BIAS perhaps??

[Coconut Monkey]

Crucial does not "rebrand" anyone else's components to make the modules they sell.

Once in a while, Crucial will offer a solution that has been made by another manufacture, ie. Samsung, Infineon if they do not have a solution available from Micron.

Bit of a contradiction there mate. ;)
They're taking Micron chips and slapping "Crucial" on the top. Admittedly, it is the same company, but with some different marketing and rebranding.

Well, that's how I see it anyway. Your definition of "rebranding" may differ. ;)

Crucial is one of the TOP TIER memory providers in the world, so it amazes me how some can flame without knowing any facts! :confused:

Who's flaming chawk? :confused:
We're just stating what we know and experiences we've heard of with product.

Hmm, the last thing I heard Corsair, Geil and Kingston do not even make their own memory components.

Like I said above, many manufacturers source the chips from elsewhere. ;)

Interesting....BIAS perhaps??

Not at all! Our advice not only comes from our own experience, but from the words of praise of enthusiasts everywhere. Hit a few overclocker forums and you'll see what we mean.

[Catweazle]

Welcome to the forum fellas. Are you enthusiasts/professionals who are outraged at my comments or people from Crucial who have signed up to respond to my comments? Either way I hope you stick around, offer help and advice, and engage in debate here :D

My earlier comments, made back in April, were as acknowledged a tad hasty. 'Twas a rather busy time for me and the implication of my comment is incorrect. Crucial is, as you say, a dicision of Micron rather than a module assembler who sources RAM chips willy-nilly.

Nevertheless, I see no reason to add them to my list of 'preferred' brands. Micron may enjoy favour from big-name system manufacturers, but they don't enjoy the same degree of favour from performance entusiasts/ overclockers, as Coconut Monkey has pointed out. The brand names I listed earlier are widely acknowledged as the brands most likely to have wide compatibility with motherboards.

[dcc]

I"m a little curious why someone would respond to a thread that hasn't been active for four months, much less two new people espousing the virtues of Crucial. :-|

[cj51]

Hi, as the original thread starter, I was surprised myself to get any more replies.

Thanks chawk02 for the recommendations - allbeit a little too late for my benefit! I'm sure other people will get benefit from your advice.

Just for the record, I resold the ram module with no problems - don't think I even lost any money either, in buying and then selling the ram.

The pc was from a non-branded source. Maybe I could have modified the bios to accept the ram - but the mobo manual showed that it would not work (I think).

I then bought a 512 mb module with 32M chips and everything works fine. The memory was not at fault - I was!

Best wishes,
Apprentice computer addict.